Chief Smoke and his family

[kingsleybray]

fantastic new data on the Shangreau and related families, thanks very much jones.

A few disjointed points. The first reference I'm aware of to a Shangreau is in Francis Parkman's Oregon Trail journal, summer 1846. On July 9th, in camp at the confluence of La Bonte creek and the North Platte, Parkman notes that "Moran's friend Jeangras [ed. comment - Gingras] brought in an antelope ... Jeangras met a party of emigrants . . . " Mason Wade, ed., The Journals of Francis Parkman, 2 vols. (London, 1947), 2: 453-54. So Shangreau (Jules?) is a presence on the North Platte by 1846.

The information on Shangreau, LaRoche, and McCloskey settling in ne. Kansas in 1854 --- that may be due to the start of Lakota hostilities that year. A number of trappers/trading personnel left the region after the Grattan fight in August 1854, staying away for a year or more.

I have a note that Jules was known as Long Hair to the Indians. I believe I have a couple other ref's relating to Jules's death, give me a little time I'll dig them out.

[jones]

<< I have a note that Jules was known as Long Hair to the Indians. I believe I have a couple other ref's relating to Jules's death, give me a little time I'll dig them out. >> -kingslybray

That's interesting that he was still known as Gingras when Parkman went through. It seems strange that such a name was phonetically equivalent to Shangreau, but that's reportedly the case. The name change must have resulted from some government official's misunderstanding, much like the mistakes that occurred at Ellis Island.
Oddly enough, even Jules Shangreau's son, Louis, spelled his name with a G., so it seems odd that documents here in Kansas have the name spelled with an S (as most histories do as well).
The "Long Hair" reference was probably from the story linked below. It's a wild tale and I wonder how much is actual fact. Nonetheless, it is a fun story with the James Gang and all.

www.thekillingofcrazyhorse.com/about-crazy-horse/unpublished-documents/eddie-herman-letter-to-george-hyde/
EDDIE HERMAN LETTER TO GEORGE HYDE, MARCH 1, 1951.

[jones]

I forgot to say -- if Eddie Herman's story is correct, Julian (AKA Gulian & Jules) was killed shortly after he returned from Kansas.
The latest document (that I know of) showing he was still here in Kansas was 1858. The Herman letter says Louis was 15 when his father was killed.
As I recall, Louis was born in 1848.

[kingsleybray]

I have copies of some letters Eddie Herman wrote to a friend of mine, now deceased, in Switzerland. They have some information on Shangreau, not the same as mentioned by Tom Powers. And I believe there is something in the Upper Platte Agency correspondence. I will try to locate this stuff -- it's boxed up at the moment.

[jones]

When I said Louis Shangreau spelled his name with a G, I was wrong. I checked the document that I was thinking about and see he spelled his name Jengraw.
Louis's life was full of heartbreak, and the letter he composed (probably written for him) describes just one of those incidents.
I transcribed the document as follows. The randomly capitalized words were actually underlined in the document, but I see no way to do that.
.......
Pine Ridge Agency Dakota Terr.
November 1st 1881
To the Hon. Commissioner of Ind. Affairs
Washington City, DC
Sir,
Am a half beef Sioux and at the urgent request of the present US Ind. Agt here, two years ago last July I was induced to take up a land claim on a stream known as The Big White Clay immediately outside the present Sioux reservation and within the limits of the state of Nebraska the object of the Agent in soliciting me with others to settle on said stream, was for the purpose (as he stated at the time) to exclude white men from "squatting" in the vicinity of this Agency -- when we were assured that we would be entitled to draw our rations as formerly and having on this Positive Assurance compiled with his request and invested all our little means in building and opening up, and otherwise improving our new homes the Agent on the first day of January last (in winter) issued a very preemptory order to the effect that all persons entitled to rations and living outside the Sioux reservation, should move and At Once within its limits, otherwise their rations would be discontinued: Many Half breeds upon the issuing of this order, (and who had made but small improvements), immediately abandoned their new homes and moved as requested, but my extended improvements would not justify me in adopting such a course and I am still living and occupying my new home and in consequence, my rations have been discontinued, the Agent plainly and manifestly went back on his word and promises and I now appeal to you for redress, as I would very much like to draw my rations as formerly for the maintenance in support of my family, a partial failure of the crops occasioned by the drouth the past season, alone prompts me to this, and I would not even now complain of the Agents present course of actions, did he full enforce and apply his January order Equally to everyone. But he has pets of his own, and some of whom are my neighbors, and who like me live outside the Sioux reservation, and who still continue to draw their rations as formerly but for some unknown cause or other, excludes me and my family from this number. Now in view of these brief facts and after having Fully Convinced Yourself, of the truth of my assertion, would you please be kind enough to request him to issue me my rations as formerly? A little aid and assistance at this time would prove of great help and benefit to me, as within a year or two I would be fully able to maintain myself and family without further aid or assistance from the government. I think (and I trust without egotism) that my undertaking is a laudable one and would prove as an example to others to eventually make themselves self sustaining and not wholly dependent on the general government for their support as at present, and in view of this I should be encouraged, instead of.being allured by False Promises and having obstacles thrown in my way, and wholly abandoned by those who should aid and assist me, by allowing me the small rations to which I am justly entitled.
Sincerely hoping to receive a favorable answer to my humble request. 
I have the honor to remain
Very respectfully your most obedient servant.
Louis Jengraw

[jones]

Oops!
I should have proof-read the letter before I posted it. The letter should begin "Am half breed Sioux" not half beef Sioux.

[Gary]

Great information! Thanks to everyone for posting these details. I need to study them carefully.

[kingsleybray]

Alex Adams, Autobiography in Beinecke Library, Yale University, writes that "A Sioux man whose name was Announcer, killed a white man who wore long locks. He was the father of Louis Shangreau, whose name was also Louis Shangreau" [sic].

In the Upper Platte Agency records is a report by Agt T. S. Twiss, Oct. 8, 1860, in which he notes "A Sioux Indian, called 'Big Mouth', who killed a white man at Cache la poudre in Sept last, has surrendered to me". Twiss's preliminary information is that there was a drunken brawl among white settlers on the Cache la Poudre (north of Denver and Ft Collins, CO). They gave whisky to the Indian - "who states to me that he was drunk- one of the white men struck the Indian, or gave offence in some way: afterwards, in the night, the Indian shot a white man by the name of Jeangras."

I can't find further statements in the UPA correspondence but to summarise it indicates that Big Mouth (later chief of the Loafer band) killed Jules Shangreau on the Cache la Poudre in September 1860.

[jones]

Thanks Kingsley, that pretty well sums it up for the who, what, when & why pertaining to Julian Shangreau's death. I wonder if Julian's traveling companion LaRoche was with him when he was killed. They (Shangreau & LaRoche) were accompanied by James McCloskey when they came to Kansas in 1854, and LaRoche appears to have left Kansas with Shangreau four or five years later. The name LaRoche appears at Pne Ridge at about the same time that Louis Shangreau's name pops up there, and a direct descendant of Louis Shangreau's told me she had a classmate named LaRoche. I'll review some of the names in my collection and see what I can piece together.

[kingsleybray]

I should have added that both Jules Shangreau's wife and Big Mouth are said to be among the children of chief Smoke, so Big Mouth and Jules would have been brothers-in-law.

[nicolas (carlo)]

That's really interesting, didn't realize his wife was Smoke's daughter. Always sad to read alcohol was involved.

[kingsleybray]

Given the date and place, it might be worth searching the Denver newspapers for contemporary reports of the Shangreau killing.

[jones]

<< Both Jules Shangreau's wife and Big Mouth are said to be among the children of chief Smoke, so Big Mouth and Jules would have been brothers-in-law. >>
Hmmm..... I am inclined to believe that is true, but I don't know how the various Smoke generations fit with Julian Shangreau's age.
  It has been several years since I got genealogical data from a descendant of Louis Shangreau, and now I can't remember if it was her data or my own conclusion that Julian Shangreau was married to Woman Dress's sister. I might have drawn that conclusion from Billy Garnett's Story of the Betrayal and Murder of Crazy Horse, as told to Major James McLaughlin, U.S. Indian Inspector, August 26, 1920:
  Nine or ten years afterwards I found out that what Woman Dress said about Crazy Horse intending to kill General Crook was not true. . . About this time Baptiste Pourier came up, and I told Louis Shangreau that Bat knew all about the matter . . . Bat said, "I will tell -- I know just exactly how it happened." He told just how it occurred, and Louis Shangreau was mad at his Uncle then, and turned and said, "You are a big liar and you are the cause of a good man's death. You were jealous of him." Then Bat, with his finger at Woman Dress, told him, " You are a liar and you are the cause of a good man's death." And Louis Shangreau said the same thing, and Woman Dress never said a word.
.......
I copied Billy Garnett's account two years before chicheman posted the same story on this forum and it is identical to what I have. The part with (his nephew) in parenthesis is identical to my transcription too.
amertribes.proboards.com/thread/1570/chief-lone-bear-oglala-lakota
chicheman 
Aug 19, 2012 
About three month afterwards, they caught Woman Dress near Fort Robinson, and W.D. came up to me with Louis Shangreau (his nephew) and said, "You can tell as good a lie as any one I ever saw"

[jones]

<< Both Jules Shangreau's wife and Big Mouth are said to be among the children of chief Smoke, so Big Mouth and Jules would have been brothers-in-law. >> -Kingsley

I'm sure that is correct.
The footnotes on the page of the book linked below says Woman dress was born in 1846, which means he and Louis Shangreau were roughly the same age and were probably first cousins, grandsons of Chief Smoke.

books.google.com/books?id=o9z3-nyIxH4C&pg=PA33&lpg=PA33#v=onepage&q&f=true
The Death of Crazy Horse: A Tragic Episode in Lakota History
edited by Richard G. Hardorff

I can't find where I got my transcription of Billy Garnett's interview, but if the copy I have was an unedited version, Billy Garnett was probably mistaken about Shangreau's relationship to Woman Dress.
 The book (linked below) has the unedited interview, but the part that mentions Louis Shangreau is unavailable in the preview. 

books.google.com/books?id=HbkHSlU1Bi0C&pg=PA74&lpg=PA74#v=onepage&q&f=true
The Killing of Chief Crazy Horse: Three Eyewitness Views
edited by Robert A. Clark, Carroll Friswold (published 1976)

[maddxp]

Thank you for letting me join this forum. I have an important and ongoing family mystery about my apparent relation to Chief Smoke. All that I've read so far about this ancestor (Suzie Smoke) appears to be limited to the Family Search and Ancestry.com apps, but outside of these apps none of Chief Smoke's recorded direct descendants include such a woman. I've searched through this forum for any additional information, but I don't find anything. I've attached the image below. Any help I can get would be much appreciated.