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Post by jinlian on Nov 27, 2012 16:16:28 GMT -5
Could be Sleep as well - according to rootsweb, they married in 1871. Besides, the woman in the second photograph posted by Gregor (btw, thanks for the great images), looks very like the elder Sleep in the 1907 photo (pag. 8 of this thread)
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Post by jinlian on Aug 9, 2012 13:43:30 GMT -5
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Post by jinlian on Dec 21, 2011 12:38:20 GMT -5
Hi Patty, sorry to come back to you thus late. Re the photograph you've asked about, I searched for it in all of my hardware, but found nothing. I suppose it came from an auction website or that somebody sent me ages ago. I'll keep searching in my present mailbox and in the former one - in case I get news of info, I'll surely let you know. Best wishes for the upcoming winter holidays,
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Post by jinlian on Jul 23, 2011 8:13:38 GMT -5
Once again on the last photo on page one! According to the Great Lakes website info, Blackfoot is third-any clarification would be good! Here is how they have the listing: thank you! Do. Matthews, Mountain Tail, Black Foot, Pounded Meat, Winking Eye, White Fawn, White Horse, Poor Elk, Shot in the Jaw, Crow, The pretty young Bull Patty, in my opinion, it should be a typo or something - comparing that photograph with the first Gardner one (posted by Dietmar on page 1), Blackfoot is clearly fourth from left, just as Carlo said before. Here: ids.si.edu/ids/dynamic?container.fullpage&id=http://sirismm.si.edu/naa/90-1/09823800.jpgyou can have a larger view of this same photograph. Philrob: Rawhide has already got it last year
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Post by jinlian on Jun 23, 2011 13:32:08 GMT -5
Hi Carlo, My take on this is that, as Curley was a Mountain Crow (see the White Man Runs Him 1919 interview by General H.L. Scott), White Swan, as his "brother" (which, in Crow kinship terms, would mean also a maternal cousin, maternal uncle or even a maternal grandmother's brother) was a Mountain Crow too.
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Post by jinlian on Jun 20, 2011 10:36:04 GMT -5
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Post by jinlian on Jun 18, 2011 18:30:48 GMT -5
Thanks for your answer, Wendell.
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Post by jinlian on Jun 18, 2011 18:27:57 GMT -5
Sorry Rod, I've just seen your message. Actually, as I've said, it's just a .doc/.pdf file summarizing what's already on this thread and in the White Swan page on the main site - anyway, if you think it could be of any use to you, I'll be glad to send. Just write me (in a private message) where I can send it. Best, J.
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Post by jinlian on Jun 18, 2011 8:13:05 GMT -5
Thanks for the continuing information, Wendyll. Can you help us with anything about the American Horse family, and how they may be related to the Smoke family? In one of the messages above I noted the sequence of the family up to American Horse. Generation A. Sitting Bear (or Brown Eagle Tail). Probably born about 1770s-80, so a contemporary of Smoke. Generation B. Three Bears (or Sitting Bear no. 2). son of above. Born ca. 1804, according American Horse winter count. Generation C. American Horse, son of above. Born 1839 or 1840. Any clues as to how they are related to the tiwahes of Smoke, Standing Bull, or Man Afraid of His Horse? Wopila mitakola! Kingsley Hello Kingsley, first, apologies for not having managed to get all the information about American Horse and his family together. Following your above question to Wendell, I'd like to point out the "infamous" half-sentence reported in Eli Ricker's notes: "Big Mouth & Blue Horse & Sitting Bear who was (illegible writing) they count from thes wives of his gr. gr. grandfather 5 generations" I have been speculating about the relationship between Chief Smoke's twins and Sitting Bear (supposing that this was Sitting Bear II, American Horse's father), assuming that probably there was some connections between their mothers. Wendell wrote that Blue Horse and Big Mouth's mother was a Sicangu , I wonder if American Horse' s mother (Sitting Bear/Three Bears' wife) was a Sicangu as well, considering American Horse close ties with the Brulé (Kinglsey reporting in another discussion that two of American Horse' wives [probably Sleep and Josie] were Iron Shell's daughters) Another American Horse question: in 1897, during an interview with Senator Pettigrew, American Horse said that ". My grandfather was a chief, but my father refused to be appointed chief, consequently the chieftainship went to another branch of the family" . Can be it read as the True Oglala band being absorbed and somehow losing its prominence?
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Post by jinlian on Jun 18, 2011 7:38:25 GMT -5
reesescup024, s! Yes... Big mouth, & Blue horse were twin bros. & sons of Smoke & his 3rd wife Burnt her woman; she was from the Sicangu! Yes... the twin bros. was born in the same year as their cousin Red cloud in 1822! Contact: W. Smoke Hi Wendell, everyone I'm catching up with the postings (due to personal problems, I've missed most of the last development of this thread) Thanks for the additional information about Big Mouth and Blue Horse. I was wondering, since Blue Horse and Big Mouth were twins, how and why was decided to give the Loafers's chieftainship to Big Mouth (in the Burbank interview, Blue Horse said that "Big Mouth was the elder", but probably this shouldn't be taken literally)? Also, I'd like to know more about the Loafers' futher splitting after Big Mouth's death, when part of them followed Blue Horse, and part chose Thigh as their leader.
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Post by jinlian on Jun 18, 2011 7:03:59 GMT -5
Thanks Hako, I had that photograph at very low resolution - it's good to have it in such great quality!
Jeroen, that's a great image I've never seen before -any further details about it? Thanks for posting it.
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Post by jinlian on Dec 28, 2010 15:29:30 GMT -5
Ledger drawing 4 Attachments:
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Post by jinlian on Dec 28, 2010 15:29:01 GMT -5
Ledger drawing 3 Attachments:
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Post by jinlian on Dec 28, 2010 15:28:03 GMT -5
Ledger drawing 2 Attachments:
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Post by jinlian on Dec 28, 2010 15:24:27 GMT -5
The only way to save this kind of images (as well as the enlargements of those on sale at ebay) it's to use an operating system (Mac or Linux) , a software (as Odin Screen Capture or FastStone) or a browser (as Maxthon) allowing the "screen capture" function. Here are some of the ledger drawings on sale at Christie's : Attachments:
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