|
Post by jinlian on Jul 12, 2008 7:12:44 GMT -5
I've spotted in the catalogue of an online bookshop this documentary: about the two Tasunka Kokipapi (father and son), based on the memories and oral traditions kept by descendants Nellie and Matthew Two Bulls. I seem to remember that there was also a book based on the same oral histories, but I'm not able to remember the title or find any web reference to it anymore. Any help would be appreciated, as well as feedback about this documentary (which I'm going to purchase in any case )
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 12, 2008 3:29:33 GMT -5
Chronologically, the last info about Sitting Bear have him as a member of the 1870 delegation (a real pity we have no photographs of him or other Oglala delegates) and participating in the following meeting with the Brunot commission. I've searched Mike Stevens' genealogy project, but it doesn't report any date for his death. My guess would be that he died in the late 1870s, but it's just a guess. Is there any reliable information about Sitting Bear's last activities and the year of his death? Thanks.
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 11, 2008 7:24:05 GMT -5
I'm really sorry to hear that too, Miyelo - I sincerely hope that measures will be taken to prevent those shameful act and ensure more respect for Pine Ridge's dead.
Let's hope that the project of a new Lakota cultural centre will take shape soon - to people who live in the area: please keep us posted about it.
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 10, 2008 11:51:06 GMT -5
This is a great resource, Wakalapi - thanks for sharing!
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 10, 2008 10:31:38 GMT -5
I think the term your looking for is 'full blood'. Thanks Clw, that sounds better - the other term made me think of Hogwarts, Harry Potter and the half-muggle wizards...
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 10, 2008 10:11:40 GMT -5
What I found strange is that such an information about an important character in Lakota history has been "hidden" that long without anybody, Lakota and non-Lakota scholars (not to mention relatives - btw, I understood that a search on Spotted Tail was made among the Clown family members), mentioning it anywhere and the statement about Spotted Tail's assassination being caused by his being not of "pure breed" (I 'm not crazy about this expression but, not being an English native speaker, am not able to find a better one). As far as I know, mixed marriages and children of those marriages were never a problem among the Lakota tribes. Do I miss something?
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 10, 2008 4:47:45 GMT -5
they had done an extensive search among all their records (probates, etc) and family members on Spotted Tail and found out he was mixed (half white). He apparently was hunka'd (adopted) by a headman named Spotted Tail who had two daughters. He hunka'd Spotted Tail to have a son and gave him his name. By the way one of the daughters was the mother of Crazy Horse's wife, Black Shawl. I think when I go back there I'm going to look these folks up. Doug said they had the paperwork. They said the prime reason Crow Dog killed Spotted Tail was not over a woman nor to break the power of the chiefs...it was because he wasn't a pure bred...yet he was making all the decisions for the tribe. ...Sorry Brock, but this sound....pretty weird, to say the least, and I suspect this "discovery" is as made up as it may be (don't want to speculate on the reasons behind it, even if I've some ideas). By the way, what does the Spotted Tail family say about this?
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 9, 2008 17:12:29 GMT -5
A few months ago, on the LBH forum, we discussed about the possibility of Cheyenne headman Tangle Hair being the son of the True Oglala leader Sitting Bear. Kingsley Bray kindly pointed me to an article by Barry C. Johnson about the seven Cheyenne's trials in 1879, where it was reported a hint, made by Tangle Hair himself, about this parentage. I finally managed to get the article, and the quote - from a local newspaper, the Fort Leavenworth Times says:
One of the party, after passing the pipe to another, endeavoured to say that he was no Cheyenne; that he was the baby of Three Bears, a noted Sioux
Now, the problem is that, from the sources I have, there's no mention of Sitting Bear being also called Three Bears. The only reference - and if this individual can be identified with the True Oglala headman - to a similar name is in the diaries of Private William Earl's Smith, where it is said that Sitting Bear, the spy sent by General Crook to the hostile Sioux and Cheyenne's camps was also called "Two Bors" (Two Bears). Personally, I'm rather skeptical about the two characters being the same person, first because William Garnett and John Bourke said that this Sitting Bear/Two Bears was in fact a Cheyenne, even if he had a Sioux family at the Red Cloud Agency, and also because it seems unlikely that an elderly and respected chief, as the True Oglala Sitting Bear was used as spy, considering also the risks involved with the mission. What's more, I've no information about the True Oglala Sitting Bear being also called "Two/Three Bears" (the only other name he may have had being the one shared by his son American Horse, as stated in a passage of Red Cloud's autobiography).
Has anyone (Kingsley, Ephriam) any source reporting alternative names as "Two/ Three Bears" for the True Oglala leader? I was wondering if the "noted Sioux Three Bears" mentioned by Tangle Hair wasn't actually the father of that Three Bears who went to Washington with the Oglala/Brulé/Arapaho delegation in 1877....but of course, this is mere speculation, as I don't know Three Bears' father's name.
Thanks everyone for your help!
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 8, 2008 15:25:25 GMT -5
Thanks for the article, Ladonna. I'm glad American Horse, who was a great leader of his people, will finally rest in the place he wanted to be. However, it makes me really sad to read about the vandalization on Pine Ridge' s cemetery and what's going on in the surroundings. Is it possible, or has there been an attempt to stop all this?
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 7, 2008 13:34:56 GMT -5
Another picture of Red Tomahawk - looks like it belongs to the same series of the other pictures posted by Dietmar elsewhere.
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 7, 2008 6:16:18 GMT -5
Hi Lowdog, About Pawnee Killer: I know of two photographs of him: This one was taken when the 1875 Lakota delegation traveled to Washington-Pawnee Killer is standing third from left, in the last row (partially covered by another Native's headdress) This portrait was made in 1877, by D. Mitchell I think. Hth, Jin
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 3, 2008 7:14:41 GMT -5
Thanks for your answer - I was just wondering if this (or other) pictures were in the Di Silvestro book about the Plenty Horses trial.
About the Indian (or half-blood) sitting between American Horse and He Dog...my first thought was Red Shirt too, but I don't remember having seen him mentioned among the trial's witnesses (on the other hand, why should he have to?). About the "rearrangement" of the trial participants, the most remarkable absences are those of Jack Red Cloud and Living Bear...the first one with some reason, but I have no explanation for the the latter.
I wonder if we're not too off topic now...should we begin a new discussion?
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 3, 2008 3:56:17 GMT -5
Wonderful picture, Grahame - has it been published somewhere?
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 2, 2008 9:46:19 GMT -5
Yes, Dietmar, the man in the second photo, standing third from left, could be in fact Little Hawk, at least from what I can see comparing this picture with another one, taken almost ten years later: Grahame, the only other picture of the Plenty Horse trial participants I know of is this one:
|
|
|
Post by jinlian on Jul 1, 2008 17:08:16 GMT -5
The 1888 Washington delegation: The Brulé are in the second row, and the Smithsonian Institute gives the following identifications (left to right) 1. Ugly Wild Horse (Bad Wild Horse) 2. Pretty Eagle (Good Eagle) 3. He Dog 4. Good Voice 5. Quick Bear 6. Black Wolf 7. Swift Bear 8. Ring Thunder 9. Two Strike 10. Grey Eagle Tail 11. Sky Bull 12. Red Fish 13. Yellow Hair 14. Eagle Horse 15. Thomas Flood, Interpreter, 16. Col. L. F. Spencer, Agent at Rosebud. I'll give a further look at it tomorrow to see if it can be of some help to identify the Natives in the second picture (too tired to do it right now ). Dietmar, you mention Living (Liver) Bear - wasn't he the father of Plenty Horses, who killed Lieutenant E. Casey in 1891? (this was a sketch done during the Plenty Horses trial) As a matter of fact, I can see some resemblance.
|
|