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Post by kayitah on Mar 21, 2013 8:02:39 GMT -5
Thanks for that very nice photograph of chief Chihuahua and his daughter Ramona. Here is what I have about Chihuahua visiting Carlisle Indian School: I also know that somehow stone-cold killers like Chihuahua became something else, once the fighting stopped. In 1894, at Mount Vernon Barracks in Mobile, Ala., where the Apaches had been moved after Florida and where they were dying in extraordinary numbers, they spoke to their old adversary-friend, Captain Marion Maus, begging to be moved somewhere healthier. Chihuahua told Maus: "I want to follow in your footsteps. [If] you want me to have a wife and to have children, put me in a good place where there are trees, good grass and water." Chihuahua also spoke of the Apache children, away at school: "I went to Carlisle (Pa.) and saw them and it made my heart feel good to see them on the white man's road and that is why I want a piece of it," he said. "I want to have things growing. I want the wind to blow on me just as it blows on everybody else. I want the sun to shine on me and the moon just as on everybody else. I want you to look at me and see that I am not what I was when you saw me before." Source: www.hikingapacheria.com/historical_chihuahua.htmlTo me, Eagan's writing stylie is a bit - let's say 'melodramatic'. Calling Chihuahua a 'stone-cold killer' is just very insensitive and far from the truth, but there's still a lot of valuable information on his website.
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Post by kayitah on Mar 5, 2013 11:02:14 GMT -5
Here's a better version of the above photograph. It's interesting that in the above (identical) picture, the name is written "Riley", while on this one it's "Reilly"! The photographer is Andrew Miller. From vintagephoto.com I got this information about him: "Andrew Miller, who came from Silver City, New Mexico to Globe in 1886 to photograph the Apache operated a gallery in Bisbee briefly in 1897. Ironically after photographing the end of the wild Apache years before, Miller was killed by the Yaqui in Sonora, Mexico 2 years later." Attachments:
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Post by kayitah on Mar 5, 2013 10:51:28 GMT -5
As for the last name "Riley", there was a rather prominent man named Sinew L. Riley. He was the son of an equally well-know scout named Dead Shot. Dead Shot, much respected by his fellow scout comrades and soldiers, held the rank of sergeant. He and two other scouts, sergeant Dandy Jim and corporal Skippy were hanged in Globe on March 3, 1882 for their actions in a controversial affair known as the Battle at Cibecue Creek or just the Cibecue Affair. Here's some more info about Sinew Riley, as well as a photograph of him with his family: www.huachuca.army.mil/files/History_ApacheScouts.pdfIn addition I have the following photograph of a scout named Riley and his wife, but I don't know for sure whether it is Sinew Riley or not, since the photograph is not dated. I will try to find out more on that matter. Attachments:
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Post by kayitah on Mar 5, 2013 10:28:11 GMT -5
Hello and welcome What little I know about John Dazen is that he was a tag band chief and that he served as a scout from Jan. 1884 to July 1885. Here's what Grenville Goodwin, who for some time lived with the people at Fort Apache and San Carlos, wrote about him: From Goodwin’s «The Social Organization of the Western Apache», Appendix C, Tag Bands, Fort Apache, p. 579 N. – Chief was tc’à’ndè-zn („long hat“), or John Dayzn, of clan 13; Canyon Creek, made up mostly of clans 12, 13, and 23. They all lived on Canyon Creek. The old chief died, and no one has been appointed in his place. The Arizona Historical Society even seems to have a photograph of him, but it needs to be ordered: beta.worldcat.org/archivegrid/data/46767104
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Post by kayitah on Feb 26, 2013 10:12:59 GMT -5
N'dé = Apache We have a couple forum members who are Chiricahua/Mescalero/Lipan/Western Apache, maybe one of them can tell you more about No-talq. You might have to wait a couple days, not everyone is online everyday, but if someone has more information I'm positive he/she will post it.
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Post by kayitah on Feb 26, 2013 5:59:50 GMT -5
Coeurrouge, here's another photo of No-Talq, a member of Chato's delegation (Washington, D.C., 1886). No-tolch or No-talq listed 7 Jul 1886 at Fort Apache and discharged 8 Oct 1886 at (!) Fort Marion with Loco, Chatto, Kaahteney and others delegates in Washington, DC + arizonian heroes Kayitah and Martine. I guess the info that has already been posted is all we know for now, sorry. Maybe our N'dé friends know more about him.
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Post by kayitah on Jan 14, 2013 9:52:21 GMT -5
"Tah-nole and Ryo-kliz, U.S. soldiers dressed in the uniform of Company J, 12th Infantry Regiment at Mt. Vernon, Alabama - Apache - circa 1889" (official caption, which is probably hardly legible as is so often the case) I think - Tah-ni-toe (b. 1855) and Go-kliz (b. 1861) Attachments:
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Post by kayitah on Jan 4, 2013 6:18:53 GMT -5
Thank you very much, coeurrouge, I wish you and all the others a very happy new year as well! May it be a good one!
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Post by kayitah on Dec 10, 2012 8:48:06 GMT -5
I would recommend Allan Radbourne's "Mickey Free: Apache captive, interpreter, and Indian Scout". Very informative and lots of details and names you will not find in any other book about Mickey. Radbourne has proven to be an exceptional researcher and an excellent writer, so basically anything written by him is highly recommendable.
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Post by kayitah on Dec 4, 2012 15:51:45 GMT -5
That would be José First, the "Hosea" of Castillo de San Marcos (name later changed to Fort Marion) José First - Charlie - Astoyeh Attachments:
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Post by kayitah on Nov 29, 2012 6:11:07 GMT -5
Interesting topic...
I have started reading Utley's "Geronimo", but I must say it has, at least so far, not really amazed me. It's not necessarily Utley's fault (since I think he's a very good scholar), it's much more because Sweeney has come up with an abundance of details on individuals in his last book (From Cochise to Geronimo), and I somewhat expected Utley to bring even more light into the dark.
The Geronimo Campaign and Geronimo's life has been rehashed countless times and, with very few exceptions, nothing new has been included in those books.
Sweeney must have spent a lot of time researching in archives, while I have the impression that not many other writers do that as well. I can fully understand when someone doesn't do it because he CAN'T do it, like european scholars for example.
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Post by kayitah on Nov 23, 2012 20:09:47 GMT -5
Thank you for the additional information. What I've found so far is a manuscript dictated by Wingar, from the University of Arizona Libraries' Special Collections. It's available for download, but it's mostly about their family's journey from Kansas to Arizona. At the end there is a chapter which deals with the Apaches at San Carlos, but no hint at your great-grandmother and her younger brother. Here's the link: azmemory.azlibrary.gov/cdm/singleitem/collection/waz/id/955/rec/4Ih-tedda was the name of one of Geronimo's wives, which leaves me a bit confused now, since it's highly improbable that the name was later given to a child among the Chiricahuas... Could it be that the name is also mangled in the Texas record you have, very difficult to read? Among the Apache, children who had lost their parents were normally orphaned by relatives, but exceptions occured... Do you have any photographs of her? Maybe some of the Chiricahuas in here can help you with more substantial information, but I'll keep searching.
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Post by kayitah on Nov 23, 2012 16:10:56 GMT -5
Hi Larry, welcome!
Well, most of the Chihenne at the reservation were among the bands of Chato, Loco, and Zele, and were sent to Florida prior to Geronimo's surrender. Very few remained among Bonito and George's bands of Chiricahuas who had - to at least some extent - intermarried and affiliated with the Western Apache, especially the White Mountain and San Carlos bands. I know that there are still some Chiricahuas at San Carlos today, but the ones who were from Victorio's band followed Loco, Nana, Geronimo and other leaders after Victorio's death.
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Post by kayitah on Nov 21, 2012 20:32:45 GMT -5
I tried to identify these men at St. Augustine, but there are quite a lot I'm not sure about. I think I also see either Noche or Cathlay in the front row, next to Baculthin, while next to Kaetenna might be Tooisgah, and lower right Mithlo... share your thoughts Attachments:
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Post by kayitah on Nov 17, 2012 13:32:59 GMT -5
I have something here I'd like to share with everyone... I ordered it from the Florida Historical Society. Too bad they didn't have any of the similar photogaphs taken at the same time. Oh well... Maybe others can come up with new and/or interesting images as well so we can have inspiring discussions again... it's been rather quiet here for way too long Attachments:
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