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Post by redroadgreatplains on Aug 6, 2020 9:12:55 GMT -5
After a month-long solo road-trip/pilgrimage across the Native heritage/history of the Great Plains a couple of years ago, I wrote about my experiences in "Red Road Across the Great Plains." Now, following on from what was almost a life-changing experience, I am carrying out serious research on what happened to (a) Black Buffalo Woman and her children (especially the last one) after her return to No Water, and (b) Black Shawl after the murder of Crazy Horse. While I would love to discover any documentation on their lives, I appreciate that I am more likely to find oral family histories, which would be as interesting for me. Unfortunately, not only have their footprints completely faded from the pages of history, but there is also a lot of misinformation and confusion, to make matters worse. If anyone is in a position to help me, I would be deeply grateful. I would be especially grateful for any contact with the Red Cloud, Spotted Tail and Crazy Horse families. I believe these women deserve better than to be so completely forgotten by history. Please help me find them!
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 15, 2020 11:28:31 GMT -5
Thanks for your request 'redroadgreatplains',
I forward this message I got per private mail for you:
Redroadgreatplains,
It always makes me happy to hear how people are interested in the Lakota people. Thank you for your input. I know you are interested in some of these great men's lives and the women who stood beside them, and I'm happy to help.
Now, interestingly, I can help a little bit with all three of these men, and a few more women. I am from the Clown family in Cheyenne River, descended from Julia Iron Cedar's eldest surviving son, Joseph, who married a granddaughter of Red Cloud and a woman named Woman Face, Emily (Emiline) Did Not Go Home, who was the daughter of Did Not Go Home and Red Cloud's daughter Plenty Horses/Mollie Many Horses. Iron Cedar's mother Red Leggings was the daughter of chief Corn and Iron Between Eyes, who was a sister of Walks With the Pipe, the mother of Spotted Tail, and thus, her "brother," in Lakota terms.
The Clown family have claimed descendancy from the Crazy Horse line through his father, Crazy Horse II/Worm. In our family tradition he married 3 sisters about 1843/44, but did not actually take the youngest (Red Leggings, who was about 15 or 16 at the time)--who requested to go with her sisters, Iron Between Horns and Kills Enemy--until later, as Rattle Blanket passed very shortly after that. We are told that Crazy Horse II/Worm then went on a 4-year-long wasigla, or mourning period, wherein he was abstinent, as well as a few other things. Then they all started to have children about 1848/1849, with Iron Between Horns and Kills Enemy having three children between them, twin girls and a boy named High Horse, who was killed fighting Crow. The girls died from sickness. Red Leggings bore Shell Blanket, Sacred Girl, Combs His Hair, Bear Pipe, Earth/Wolf, and Iron Cedar.
According to what we were told after the death of Young Man Crazy Horse III, the famous warrior, Black Shawl stayed with this family for a couple years, until we were able to go back north to the Moreau River area with no problems, where she stayed for a little bit, since Worm was elderly by this time--in his 70s--and she helped out up there before going back down south to the White River area. I don't know what happened to her afterwards.
The medicine bundle and pipe of Crazy Horse was kept at first by Worm, but then given to Combs His Hair about the time of the move north, late summer/early fall 1881 as I was told, and then after his death, to the last surviving sibling of Crazy Horse, his youngest sister Iron Cedar, who kept it until her death in 1936, when her husband Amos Old Eagle Clown took possession of it. A couple years later Amos gave it to his son Edward, Joseph's brother, along with a rifle and the "waksica," or eating utensils (including the 2-pronged fork and wooden bowl) that belonged to Crazy Horse. In the 60s Edward had bad dreams and so buried the medicine because "it was too strong," but left everything else. Shortly thereafter it was stolen when the house was broken into and ransacked. The pipe has since been found and returned (which was a story in and of itself!) but the bowl and gun are still gone, along with the other pipes that were in the house. We know where the gun is, but have no way of proving original ownership, since it was aquired at the Battle of Little Bighorn. To this day Crazy Horse's pipe is at Cheyenne River. It is never displayed or made a huge issue of. The theft of it was known to people who were alive when it happened, including to someone who was a young boy when it happened and was living with Edward and Amy Clown.
I don't know a lot about Black Buffalo Woman, but that the Star/Starr families from Pine Ridge come from her and No Water, and that they are related to the Black Bear family from Cheyenne River, one of Black Buffalo Woman's relatives. I think I remember hearing that you don't really see her on the census records, but you see No Water and a wife who was called something like "Black Crow," who I think was Black Buffalo Woman in a mispelling, should be Black Cow Woman, if that was their intent as translation. I don't know all their children. There's always been rumors of a daughter with Crazy Horse, but no one knew anything then, and no one claims descendancy through any daughter now. But, a lot of secrecy went on in those days. We in our family were told that many people who were close to Crazy Horse helped us hide, including Chips, He Dog, Red Feather, Black Fox, and others. So if it happened with one family, it certainly could happen with another. But we know nothing of any daughter or other possible child with Crazy Horse.
One branch of the Clown family says she simply sought refuge with Crazy Horse after No Water "silya okih'an," treated her badly, and that she was with her Black Bear family during the stay up north. According to that version, they all got together in one of Crazy Horse's relatives camps, and Black Buffalo Woman, "lionizing" Crazy Horse, did most of the serving at a get-together at another of the relative's tipi when No Water came in, and after the shooting of Crazy Horse, she fled in refuge to her uncle Black Bear, who refused to give her up without assurance that nothing would happen to her. I was never told this particular story by the source who told me what I know, but from another branch of the family, the Edward Clown branch, in fact. The stories I know come from Joseph Clown's line. He was my g-g-grandfather.
I wish I could be of more help concerning these women. They do deserve more than to be relegated to the appendices as minor characters in a man's biography, even a great man like Crazy Horse. I can tell you that Black Shawl stayed in the area that would eventually be the site of Amos Clown and Julia Iron Cedar's home, when it was just a remote circle of tipis, before her return down south. Her extended families are still around in both Pine Ridge, and Cheyenne River, and I'm sure in Rosebud as well. The same for Black Buffalo Woman. The Black Bear family is still around, quite a large family, in fact, and is thriving. Her direct descendants through the Star Comes Out/Star/Starr families are alive and well on the Pine Ridge, Rosebud and Cheyenne River reservations. Some people still know where these families come from, and through them, these women's lives are remembered.
I hope this helps. Sees His Horse--Cheyenne River Reservation
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Post by redroadgreatplains on Aug 21, 2020 1:37:41 GMT -5
Thank you, Dietmar. This is incredibly helpful. Sees His Horse - I really cannot tell you how thrilled I am that you made contact and that you are willing to share your illustrious family's story. I am a very serious researcher of this and definitely no superficial enthusiast. Above all, I am interested in the AUTHENTIC Lakota side of history. For more on my credentials, and my book "Red Road Across the Great Plains", please do visit my website www.dawnvoyager.com. I am currently re-reading the Edward Clown Family's book and corresponding with its author, William Matson. However, I do have a lot more questions and no one can answer them more accurately than another direct family member such as you. So, if you can bear to be patient with my multitude of queries, may I please email you directly. My email address is penelope.dawnvoyager@gmail.com. PLEASE write to me - I am hugely excited to correspond with you, and perhaps bring some historical justice to these two neglected women.
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Post by redroadgreatplains on Oct 20, 2020 1:39:25 GMT -5
My researches seem to indicate that Black Shawl's father was the brother of Spotted Tail who was killed by the Pawnees in 1866 (I have not been able to discover his name). Is this correct? Does anyone have a view? Secondly, I have located a Death record on the Cheyenne River Reservation rolls for Black Shawl (#581), showing her death there, from unknown causes, on 1st November 1925. This seems to be quite definitive and disproves the various dates floated by historians and authors over the years - 1920, 1927, 1930). Again, does anyone have any views on this? The only thing that puzzles me is, what was she doing at Cheyenne River Reservation? I would have expected her to be either at Red Cloud or Spotted Tail.
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Post by frenchman on Oct 21, 2020 9:54:39 GMT -5
Greetings from France , I had read somewhere that the name of the Spotted Tail's brother killed in 1866 ( may be 1867 ) was "Blue Around the Face " (but it is not sure that he had been a real brother of the Brulé chief )Best regards !
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Post by redroadgreatplains on Jan 6, 2021 1:08:14 GMT -5
Going through the Crazy Horse Surrender Ledger, I find that Black Shawl was not with him. Does anyone have any idea where she was at the time of his surrender, and when she moved to him at Red Cloud Agency?
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ted
New Member
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Post by ted on Jan 6, 2021 10:06:42 GMT -5
Let's not forget that the Oglala side of Crazy Horse family and historical evidence prove, claim, that the Clown family are related to Crazy Horse by marriage only and Red Leggings was not his biological sister. Woman Breast, ( Tits) and Old Crazy Horse(Waglula) are not the same person as per Crazy Horse Oglala family. Old Crazy Horse according to military records died in November 1881. According to Lakota historian, Lakota instructor and Lakota teacher Francis White Lance, Crazy Horse medicine bundle went to his cousin Fast Thunder.
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Post by redroadgreatplains on Jan 8, 2021 4:39:57 GMT -5
Unfortunately, almost all the above is incorrect. Red Leggins was Crazy Horse's step-mother (married to Waglula) and not his sister, while both geneology, as well as legal documentation, clearly prove the Clown family's blood relationship to Crazy Horse. Moreover, his medicine bundle went to his father, who passed it on to Leo Combing, a son of Red Leggin. It is now with Edward Clown, some of it having been burgled in the 1960s. There is certainly a degree of controversy about Woman Breast and Waglula, and no conclusion is definitive. However, having studied the issue in detail, especially in relation to chronology, I am convinced that the Clown Family's history is correct, and that the two were one and the same person. I am not sure what military records you are referring to with regard to Waglula's death, but I have not been able to locate any such document so far. The 1881 death is confirmed by Kingsley Bray while the Clown Family put it at 1900. I have been attempting to locate some documentation to prove one date or the other.
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ted
New Member
Posts: 23
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Post by ted on Jan 10, 2021 10:29:47 GMT -5
[deleted]
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Post by Dietmar on Jan 10, 2021 12:22:10 GMT -5
Well, I knew what was coming. In fact, I've had it with Ted, who always comes out of the bush on only one topic.
Here, of course, anyone can write that he doesn't believe in the close connection between Crazy Horse and the Clown Family. Californian for example just did the same.
What I don't like is such a polemical tone. This is a history site and not there for personal hostility.
I'm afraid you'll have to find another site, Ted.
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doc
New Member
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Post by doc on Feb 28, 2022 19:56:33 GMT -5
Hello, everyone! Is there any record of the names of Black Buffalo Woman's four children and their approximate years of be birth and death?
The possibility of her fourth light skinned child, supposedly a girl, being the only surviving child of Crazy Horse (Tashunka Witko) is especially intriguing.
Given the fact that he was greatly hated by the whites of his day and in fact murdered by them, it is totally understandable that his descendant and other immediate family members felt a need to remain anonymous for the sake of their own lives. However, to know the Lakota names of these children would be appreciated. Thank you!
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Post by wambli ahitunwan on Mar 5, 2022 1:15:47 GMT -5
Perhaps this topic is dead, since only one post above has been added in more than a year, but I am also interested in the questions Doc asked in the recent previous post above. Can anyone provide the answers?
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Post by Steve White-Provost Oizumi on Dec 13, 2022 18:01:37 GMT -5
Here is some research around this topic
About 1842* (Crazy Horse DOB) + ([White*]?) = 1866* (Crazy Horse 24*) = (Mary [White*]?) ******************* Crazy Horse continued to pay her attention and in [1866*] eloped with her while No Water was on a hunting party.
Black Buffalo Woman’s fourth child, a [girl*], was a light-skinned baby suspected of being the result of her night with Crazy Horse. ******************* Crazy Horse had very strong ties to this band – indeed an agency document from 1874 (Mary [White*]? 8*) states that he was an Oyuhkpe. One Oyuhkpe sub-band was known as the Wakan or Sacred band
In 1866, the discovery of gold along the Bozeman Trail in Montana spurred General William Tecumseh Sherman to build a number of forts in Sioux territory.
The nationality of Mrs. (Mary Saunders/[White*]?/Russell) J. Russell was Oyuhkpe Oglala Lakota Sioux. Mrs. (Mary [White*]?) J. Russell was born in 1866*. (Mary [White*]?) J. was listed as the "Head of the Household" ****************************** Lema (Born [White*]?) Russell/Provost- DOB 1909 (Mother Mary [White*]? 43) Noted as "Lena" on probate ********************* 1964 (SRP) -1948 ( [White*]? Provost) =16. Mother Lema* (Born [White*]?) Russell 39
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Post by Dietmar on Dec 15, 2022 16:24:32 GMT -5
Thanks Steve,
actually I haven´t heard about these names before, I mean Mary [White], Mary Saunders, etc. Where is this from?
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Post by Steve White-Provost Oizumi on Jan 1, 2023 19:42:34 GMT -5
My grandma - Lema, born a white and Mary, Oyunkpe Oglala Lakota, was her mother. I have been unable to identify the 'White" Mary was married to [Grandma Lema's Father] thus far so I have blocked the name [White*] for now as an * as it is also noted on my moms South Dakota birth certificate from 2004 for her first name. My uncle Willie can also be found in the legal records in the Minnesota Historical Archives for Wounded Knee. I suspect the incident at Oglala in 75 or around wounded knee siege events earlier as the records are suppressed. According to my mom, Mary was briefly married to a Saunders [generally misspelled on documents as Sanders- German] and if I understood correctly, had children already with her from a BlueHorse when sheltered with Saunders. Saunders was later killed in a bar fight. My earliest memories of family oral stories is "they" are mad at us because we killed Custer and Mary was in Crazy Horses camp as a young person and spoke of his hazel eyes. According to records I have come across Crazy Horse was with Black Robe/Buffalo Women around 1866/7, around the same time as Mary's birth and may be why the 4th child or that branch of the tree would not be talked about much. So, in short without absolutism, I am considered an ICWA kid and this is as close to understanding why I am an enrolled member of the Oglala Sioux Tribe after 58 years - besides my Grandpas link which goes back up to Antoine Janis and Mary First Elk Women which is better documented around the 1868 fort Laramie treaty. As for the Russell name, Mrs. J Russell, Oyunkpe Oglala Lakota can be found in a search and Crazy Horses strong ties to this band. According to my mom, he was called grandpa "jack" [John "Jack" Russell] and was a red headed orphan boy that the tribe adopted as they were intrigued by the color of his red hair plus he was probably hungry. He knew where Crazy Horse was buried and there was a marker for him for a time back "home" is how my mom says. So with all that said and I have hazel eyes, I am suspicious Hope this helps. Thanks, Steve
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