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Post by grahamew on Aug 15, 2019 11:30:18 GMT -5
Yeah. I'm sticking with wotawe
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Post by grahamew on Aug 9, 2019 13:52:10 GMT -5
North Dakota History Vol 40, No 2, Summer 2016 reprints the trial photo and notes that Sitting Bull and his followers were disciplined by the authorities for their actions on the Crow reservation... Read more: amertribes.proboards.com/thread/201/rain-face?page=9#ixzz5w8DGLn6RBut no real evidence beyond that - and that the Crow agent wanted him shipped off to Florida. For all I know the supposition that he was disciplined comes solely from the inscription on the photo. It may be that it's just a slap on the wrist in public - something that happened as part of a general council meeting. Never fails to amaze me, however, bearing in mind Sitting Bull spent eight years of his life under white scrutiny and record keeping that biographies dwell mainly on his earlier life the fairly quickly move on to the Ghost Dance and his demise.
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Post by grahamew on Aug 9, 2019 11:52:05 GMT -5
Goff probably arrived in Yankton in 1872 to work with Stanley Morrow, no less, established his own studio in Bismarck in Autumn, 1873; by the following Spring, he had opened a new gallery at Fort Abraham Lincoln and by mid-1877 was back at Bismarck. The usual assumption is that Goff took this photo of Brave Bear - and that it is the man later known as Bob Brave Bear - which, of course, may not be the case as there are three different Brave Bears in The Sitting Bull Surrender Census alone. I would assume that it's taken prior to his initial arrest because I can't see McLaughlin or the army trooping him from Fort Totten (according to McLaughlin's account) to Goff's studio for a mugshot, especially when considering McLaughlin's fear of his escape. Could it have been taken when he went to Bismarck before his trial at Fargo? It's often assumed that the early photo of Rain in the Face was taken by Goff or Haynes (but in this case, by the backdrop, it is Haynes) while he was captive at Fort Abraham Lincoln, though I'm not sure I buy into that any longer (the backdrop is the same as Haynes' photo of Chief Joseph from 1877 for a start) and according to Louis Garcia's account, that's where Brave Bear was first captured in 1874 by Tom Custer (who also took Rain prisoner). Notice how Louis' account differs from McLaughlin's and the events are spread over a few years before his recapture at Totten in 1877 (78, according to McLaughlin). However, I still can't see a fugitive Indian, who seems to have been well-known, rocking up at a photographer's studio for his photograph Jesse James-style, so I'm guessing this was taken early in 73 or 74 - unless it's the alternate scenario where he was photographed while at Ft Abraham Lincoln. One thing's for certain: when Brave Bear escapes, that's it. There's no chance of another photo until his recapture in late 81/early 82. So if this is Brave Bear - and I'll grant you, there are similarities, though I think he looks younger and his mouth is smaller - was this taken while he was awaiting trial (possibly as many as six years later), hence the cropped hair and the clothing? Brave Bear doesn't seem to have endeared himself to the Lakota at whose agencies he sought sanctuary until he killed Joseph Johnson and left for Sitting Bull's band in Canada. When Sitting Bull surrendered, Brave Bear left his camp a day later (a Brave Bear's wife and child are in the Sitting Bull transfer list, but not Brave Bear himself) and was eventually arrested and his trial began in 1882, found guilty and sentenced to death, though there were several postponements and he wasn't hung until November. Ladonna has already shown he wasn't related to Sitting Bull, but he claimed to be his son-in-law at the trial. According to T he Chamberlain Register, reprinted in The Yankton Daily Press and Dakotaian, Sitting Bull had denounced Brave Bear late 1881 (possibly because he'd left his wife and child). One of the two interpreters and a witness at the trial was Fish Allison and at the time of Brave Bear's arrest, he was carrying a card signed by Allison that said he was entitled to whiskey. Makes you wonder how a fugitive Indian obtained that from someone in government employ. McLaughlin tried to have the sentence commuted on the grounds that stealing and killing were considered acts of bravery, though Dennis Pope, in Sitting Bull: Prisoner of War, points out that the manner in which the acts were carried out would have been regarded as murder by the Lakota too . Pope also notes that Brave Bear (who McLaughlin refers to as a dandy or dude) was known for dressing as a white man. Makes you wonder how long he was known as Bob and how long he'd dressed like this, which might rule out the photo of him in braids, fur cap and feathers. Note the style of name-plate often found on Barry's photos. Despite the name-plate, do the Barry photos even show the same man? Why is he dressed in the same vest, necklace and ermine skin that Louis Sitting Bull is wearing? I had thought, by my - admittedly non-too scientific - reckoning, Barry wasn't using this backdrop until 1883, after Bob Brave Bear's execution, but if it was a year earlier, why would a man who had already escaped twice and was facing the death penalty be allowed to go to Barry's studio at Bismarck or Fort Yates to have a series of photos taken and why would he be allowed to borrow some of Louis Sitting Bull's clothing? However, to be honest, I can also see similarities between this man and the one wearing the hat! Louie/s Sitting Bull with the Barry label Louis/Louie Sitting Bull - clearer version Note the Barry logo on the frame, though he took over Goff's studio and presumably sold some of the latter's work. What is interesting is that the tribal attribution is Hunkpapa whereas Bob Brave Bear was a Cut Head Yanktonai, but perhaps this was because of his later association with Sitting Bull's band.
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Post by grahamew on Aug 9, 2019 9:35:06 GMT -5
Great information, though, Carlo. Thanks for posting.
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Post by grahamew on Aug 6, 2019 14:38:04 GMT -5
As far as I can tell - largely from Vestal and Utley, but also from Brian Jones monograph, A Battle at Little Big Horn - Sitting Bull made the visit in September 1886 after the Lakota petitioned the Indian Office in order to obtain permission and it went ahead over the objections of the Crow agent, Henry Williamson. This is when the breechclout incident (the Crow was named Crazy Head) occurred and this led to an argument with Shave Head because he felt SB was publicly shamed by the event. Ironically, it also led to an argument with Bull Head because he wanted a particular horse that the Crow gave Sitting Bull but he gave it to Catch the Bear instead. Sitting Bull was accompanied by about 100 Lakota from Standing Rock and Cheyenne River and they stayed with the Crows about two weeks. The Crows were in the process of going along with the allotment of their land, but then began to object and the agent blamed this on Sitting Bull's interference. If I'm reading Utley correctly, Williamson and other officials called a council and 'included their prime suspect. "Sitting Bull said he did not want his lands allotted yet and had asked the agent to delay."' Williamson noted that several Crow leaders who hadn't previously objected to allotment, changed their minds and Utley says the Crow chiefs were 'convinced by Sitting Bull' and continued to stall on the issue for months after Sitting Bull left. This was a year before the Sword Bearer 'uprising' so it's feasible that the Barry photo - if it does show Sitting Bull's trial - was actually taken in 1886 (though dating of Barry's work is often hit and miss). The more direct Lakota connection with Sword Bearer was when a group Lakota from Rosebud* went to visit the Crows in June, 1887. A party soldiers under Lt Edwards tried to turn them back, and some of the followers of Sword Bearer tried to intervene before another party of Crows came to protect the soldiers and sent the others packing. Ironically, one of the key participants in the angry group was He Knows his Coups, the son of the same Crazy Head that flipped off his breechclout in front of Sitting Bull's face. Inspector Frank C. Armstrong, keen to push the allotment of reservations, was tasked with investigating and compiling a report on the Sword Bearer affair and among the causes, referred to Sitting Bull's visit, claiming he had told the Crow that the Lakota had made demands on the government and had got what they wanted. Armstrong suggested Siting Bull be sent to Florida "before he causes more trouble." Utley's sources for this 1886 date include a report by Agent Williamson (dated Sept 27, 1886), US Indian Agent James Howard to CIA (same date) and the McLaughlin Papers. North Dakota History Vol 40, No 2, Summer 2016 reprints the trial photo and notes that Sitting Bull and his followers were disciplined by the authorities for their actions on the Crow reservation... I haven't seen any mention of Rain in the Face or Grass being present during Sitting Bull's visit to the Crow (although it's reasonable to think they might have been there) except on whatever auction site was selling the photos of the dancing. As for the trial, I can find no mention of it other than in connection with the photos and while it's entirely possible and in-keeping with his character that McLaughlin would stage some kind of show trial like this, it may well be some other council, perhaps one from August 1888 to discuss allotment (where, according to Utley, the mounted Rain in the Face was present). A closer view... The text with the images on sale at Worth Point states the photos were taken by "S.F. "Dick" Fansler... at the June 1886 celebration held when the Custer Battlefield was made a National Monument." It doesn't look awfully like John Grass to me. The memorial was built in 1881 and its dedication wasn't confirmed until December, 1886, but there was a tenth anniversary of the battle in June 1886 which Gall attended, gave his version of events and accused Curley of being a coward, so this was two months before Sitting Bull visited the Crow... As I've said elsewhere, as far as I know, Fansler was in Ohio until 1889/90 and didn't open his studio until 1892. A better suspect might be Goff - or Barry, who took several photos of the occasion. In fact, according to Fleming and Luskey, Fansler occupied the same studio at Fort Yates that Barry and, prior to that, Goff used and we all know that some photographers of this period sold - sometimes with permission - the works of others, labeling it as their own, which I assume is what we're seeing here. Later, some of Fansler's own images were sold as the work of Frank Fiske, who was Fansler's apprentice.Here's another copy of the trial photo: Some of the other photos from which is patently the same event do not show Sitting Bull and I wonder if the one below shows John Grass, in his capacity as judge, from behind. There are several other men wearing the same type of hat, so this is not a lot to go on, I know, but it is similar to the one he wears in another Barry photo: Notice, while I'm at it, that this photo also shows Rain-in-the Face, mounted again, but blurred and at the back this time, next to a man who seems to have two cigarettes in his mouth: Finally, the 'trial' photos would appear to be unrelated to the Dedication of Standing Rock: Sitting Bull is wearing a darker (or dirty) shirt and his leggings have a broad dark stripe - Hudson Bay blanket style across the bottoms, with scalloped edges and he's wearing fairly plain moccasins; in the 'trial' photos, they appear to be blue or red stroud and his moccasins are heavily beaded. * I wonder if this group was merely visiting the Crow Agency, or were curious about Swordbearer - or maybe they were recruits to his cause, since he tried to recruit Cheyenne, Lakota and Piegan.
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Post by grahamew on Aug 6, 2019 12:22:20 GMT -5
Yes, you're right, it is the backdrop featured in photos of members of the Sitting Bull Combination (though not SB, as far as I can tell), rather than the one used in the Gall photos. I wonder if she was a member of the Combination, though the name on the photo (and I've seen two more different images to yours and they all use that label) doesn't match the names of anyone on any of the lists of participants I've seen. amertribes.proboards.com/thread/869/sitting-bull-combination
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Post by grahamew on Aug 6, 2019 3:27:42 GMT -5
The background - the fake rocks - remind me of some of barry's gall photos
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Post by grahamew on Aug 5, 2019 12:26:20 GMT -5
I suspect the same.
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Post by grahamew on Aug 5, 2019 5:19:36 GMT -5
I don't have my books at the moment but I recall a crow leader jerking off his breechclout to insult sb who took it in good faith and everything was fine after that. This get together is supposedly when fansler took those photos of rain and John grass dancing though this is way too early for fansler and while that might be rain, it doesn't look like grass. And, of course, if you're taking photos of prominent lakota, why not photograph sb?
Apologies for the lower case!
If they were taken in 86 on the crow agency, I would have thought goff to be the likely photographer. Always possible fansler got hold of the images and sold them as his own as fiske did with some of fans let's work.
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Post by grahamew on Aug 5, 2019 3:53:35 GMT -5
So... did this 'trial' exist as something drummed up by mclaughlin to diminish sitting bull or have the photos been deliberately mislabelled to make a council of some sort look more exciting?
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Post by grahamew on Aug 4, 2019 4:26:57 GMT -5
Didn't work for Mangas Coloradas that way.
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Post by grahamew on Jul 31, 2019 4:42:47 GMT -5
Doesn't look like much of a court but that's how I've seen it referred to. Have to admit that I thought the visit of occurred in 86.
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Post by grahamew on Jul 30, 2019 16:57:24 GMT -5
It's supposedly at the 'trial' of sitting bull for riling up the crows during a visit to their reservation in 1886 - so, 86 or 87.
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Post by grahamew on Jul 25, 2019 12:18:56 GMT -5
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Post by grahamew on Jul 25, 2019 11:54:26 GMT -5
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