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Post by ephriam on May 7, 2009 0:33:10 GMT -5
Welcome Aurelia,
Thank you for your willingness to share more about your family.
The name of your great great grandfather, Fights With Thunder, first appears in the agency records in 1881. As you probably already know, Spotted Eagle surrendered at Fort Keogh on October 30, 1880 with about 495 people. In the summer of 1881, he and the Itazipcho were transferred to the Standing Rock Agency. He is counted there with 402 people. Then in August or September 1881, he transfered with 36 families to the Cheyenne River Agency while the largest percentage of the Itazipcho remained at Standing Rock. (Most of these finally joined their relatives at Cheyenne River in the spring of 1882)
Among those listed in the 36 families transferred with Spotted Eagle from Standing Rock to Cheyenne River in the late summer of 1881 is Fights Thunder. He then appears in the regular Cheyenne River Reservation census from 1886 through at least 1900.
Do you know if Fights the Thunder and Spotted Eagle had the same parents (Red Thunder and Iron Branch)? Were there other brothers or sisters in the family? Do you know what year Fights the Thunder died?
ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Apr 1, 2009 16:13:30 GMT -5
I finally found the right document: Bad Wound III died Nov. 26, 1916.
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Post by ephriam on Mar 31, 2009 10:22:07 GMT -5
Kingsley:
Been thinking some more about your interpretation of the Adams' journal with Bad Wound splitting off from Man Afraid's Hunkpatila band during the winter of 1844-45 and joining the southern Oglala as a new band leader.
Since I have been assuming that the Tasnaheca Band was much older, I had not paid much attention to a comment by John Colhoff -- but now it makes more sense. In his letter to Balmer (Nov. 16, 1949), he suggested that the Tasnaheca formed "around the 1840's and 50's." That would fit well with your timeline. This would suggest then that Charles Turning Hawk's comment (Mekeel field notes) that his grandfather, Bad Wound I, was "a big chief of the Tashnaitca" is inaccurate, since the band did not form until decades later.
I am only aware of two lists of the members of the Tasnaheca band. The first one is the 1874 Census by Dr. J. J. Saville that you posted above (21 families/132 people); the second is the 1890 census, which lists 25 families/93 people. Only a few of the names correlate. In the census records, Bad Wound's group is generally listed under the larger Kiyuksa grouping as the other southern Oglala bands are.
It is also interesting to note that the Tasnaheca were considered to be the parent band, in part, for at least two other Oglala bands: the Hokayuta (Badger Eaters) which split off about 1851 and the Cankahuhan (Sorebacks) which formed I suspect about this same time period. This might suggest some devisive politics within the Tasnaheca over the Horse Creek Treaty of 1851. The evidence suggests that Black Rock, the father of He Dog and head of the Sorebacks, was a brother of Bad Wound. No Water and Black Twin were mentioned as leaders of the Tasnaheca originally, then of the Hokayuta; perhaps they are related to the Bad Wound family as well.
Ephriam
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Patesni
Mar 29, 2009 18:19:08 GMT -5
Post by ephriam on Mar 29, 2009 18:19:08 GMT -5
One other thought. George Flying By, in his 1912 interview with Walter Camp, said that Lame Deer "had 7 girls and 3 boys." He then listed the three boys as: "Flying By and Fool Heart -- Chante Witko; Shoot Bear Running -- Mato Kute Inyaike." He then noted that his two brothers were "now dead".
Did Not Butcher was still alive in 1912. If he was a brother, why did George Flying By not mention him and why did he say that his brothers were all dead.
Perhaps John Lame Deer was incorrect in the relationship? Or perhaps he was a "son" in the broader Lakota sense?
ephriam
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Patesni
Mar 29, 2009 17:53:04 GMT -5
Post by ephriam on Mar 29, 2009 17:53:04 GMT -5
Kingsley: That is correct. Take a look at the Joseph Flying Bye discussion string (under Hunkpapa).
FLYING BY, GEORGE Kinyan Hiyaye (c1851-1930). Minnecojou. Name also translated as Flying Along and Flying Away. Also known as Struck or Struck Plenty. Younger son of Lame Deer.
As noted above, the remnants of Lame Deer's band surrendered and were transferred to the Standing Rock Agency. They were initially counted under Lame Deer's son, Crazy Heart/Foolish Heart. In the Sitting Bull Surrender Census, this band numbers 26 families/112 people. Agent McLaughlin also issued annuities to this band in December 1881; his list includes 32 families or 104 people. Part of this band transferred with Fool Heart to Cheyenne River; part remained at Standing Rock under Struck also known as Struck Plenty. In the Sitting Bull Surrender Census, this man is listed as Flying Along; in the later census records, he is listed as Struck. He is again referred to as Flying By beginnng with the 1892 census. (Hence the speculation that Lame Deer and the original Minneconjou headman Flying By were possibly brothers and that when the first Flying By died without children, his nephew took the name. But I have no proof of this.)
Dietmar's contribution only adds to the list of Lame Deer's children. Several accounts say that Lame Deer had three sons, but we have a number of different names.
According to Flying By, the three sons were: Fool Heart, Flying By and Shoot Bear Running. Then from Lame Deer: Seeker of Visions, we have Crazy Heart, Flying By and Did Not Butcher. And we have the contemporary accounts that identify Fast Bull as a son of Lame Deer. Can we make sense of this?
ephriam
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Patesni
Mar 29, 2009 15:20:51 GMT -5
Post by ephriam on Mar 29, 2009 15:20:51 GMT -5
Thank you for the great photograph of Did Not Butcher. I have not seen that one before. Does anyone know the source of the original photograph?
Dietmar: you mentioned that one of Lame Deer's sons was named Did Not Butcher. What is your source for that? According to George Flying By, Lame Deer had three sons: Fool Heart, Flying By and Shoot Bear Running.
DID NOT BUTCHER, PAUL Patesni (c1854-1934). He first appears in the Standing Rock Agency records in late 1881 as a member of Fool Heart and later George Flying By's band of Minneconjou (recall from an earlier discussion that Flying By was originally known as Struck). In the spring of 1882, Fool Heart and part of the band transferred to the Cheyenne River Agency; part remained behind at Standing Rock under the leadership of Struck/Flying By. Did Not Butcher was among those who remained behind at Standing Rock.
Did Not Butcher married about 1884-86 and had a number of children, three of whom were still living in 1910. He died of heart trouble on March 7, 1934.
Interestingly, when he was asked in 1910 about his tribe, he listed his father as Upper Brule and his mother as Minneconjou; his wife was a Hunkpapa (she listed her father as Hunkpapa and her mother as Minneconjou so she probably considered herself Minneconjou). The family surrendered with Lame Deer's band and were eventually counted as Hunkpapa at Standing Rock. I cannot identify him in the Sitting Bull Surrender Census though he is probabaly there by a different name.
I would like to know more about his possible relationship to Lame Deer!
ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Mar 29, 2009 15:04:15 GMT -5
I stand corrected! Because of the bad spelling and grammar, sometimes working with the Adams journal is difficult -- I missed the other references to Bad Wound! With that additional information, I agree with you that it appears that Bad Wound was associated initially with the Hunkpatila at the beginning of that winter and then moved to the southern Oglala.
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Post by ephriam on Mar 28, 2009 10:02:09 GMT -5
Kingsley:
I read the references to Bad Wound in the David Adams Journals a little different than you did.
I could not verify your reference to Bad Wound as a "brave" or head soldier in Man Afraid's band. Under the date Nov. 1841 (p. 19), Adams makes reference to Man Afraid as "the brav" but no mention of Bad Wound. Did I miss it?
Bad Wound is mentioned twice. On Nov. 4, 1845, he, together with Man Afraid, Medicine Man and Shell, attempted to persuade Adams to send a trader to their village(s). Then on Feb. 6, 1845, Adams notes that the Lakota had divided, with some camping with the Cheyenne while another part led by Old Borne, Bad Wound and Whirlwind had gone to Horse Creek "with their bands." Bad Wound appears to be a headman, not a head soldier, by this time.
I know that George Hyde initially assigned Bad Wound to the Hunkpatila but I think he was wrong. I question whether Bad Wound was ever part of the Hunkpatila. It was not uncommon for bands to camp together in winter camps. My read of these brief references in Adams' journals was that a part of the southern Oglala (including the Tasnaheca) spent the winter of 1844-45 camped with the Hunkpatila, then headed back down to the Platte River and probably continued on to the Republican River country with the other southern Oglala.
ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Mar 23, 2009 12:17:14 GMT -5
Some thoughts about Bad Wound:
Bad Wound I -- Charles Turning Hawk mentioned in an interview that his grandfather was the first Bad Wound, "a big chief of the Tashnaitca" tiyospaye of the Oglala. Presumably Bad Wound I is the individual mentioned by Lewis & Clark. Hyde mentions that one of the Bad Wounds died in 1865 (I have not been able to verify his source yet); I suspect that this was Bad Wound I.
Bad Wound II was the father of Charles Turning Hawk, who mentioned that he had a number of wives and as many as 26 sons! Based on his children's years of birth, I am guessing that he was born circa. 1800-1810. I assume he is the one who signed the Fort Laramie Treaty of 1851 and the Treaty of 1868. In the records of the Red Cloud Agency where he settled in the early 1870s, he is usually referred to as "Old Bad Wound" to distinguish him from his son "Young Bad Wound." Bad Wound II is listed in the agency records up through the 1880-82 period but is not in the 1886 census, suggesting that he died sometime in the early 1880s. (We have not found census records for the period between 1882-86)
Bad Wound III or "Young Bad Wound" was born about 1832 or 1833 and assumed his father's role as leader of the Tasnaheca Band (Oglala). Like his father, he settled at the Red Cloud Agency during the early 1870s. He went to Washington, D.C. with the 1875 delegation and signed the Treaty of 1876. Either he (or his father) accompanied Red Cloud in May 1877 to meet Crazy Horse and other northern leaders as they were en route to surrender at Red Cloud. Bad Wound III married Good Woman probably about 1860 and then Red Top about 1873. His children included: Daniel (b. c1861), Noah (c1867-1930), Robert (c1871-1940) and Millie. Contrary to Donovin Sprague's comment in his photo book of the Pine Ridge Reservation, Bad Wound III died in late 1917 or early 1918 (I am still searching through the Pine Ridge Reservation records to find the exact date).
Bad Wound III's children continued the family tradition of participation in tribal government. Noah served as a tribal judge and Robert became the first tribal President in 1935 under the Indian Reorganization Act.
ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Jan 21, 2009 9:14:02 GMT -5
Thanks Kingsley for posting this. I had not read this one before. This book can also be found on Google Books, for those who want to see a scanned version of the original book.
Graham: Tavernier was at one of the 1874 sun dances while Schwatka, who was stationed at Camp Sheridan, saw one of the 1877 dances.
I am interested in one of Johnson's comments. While describing the dentalium used on women's dresses and earrings, she refers to the shells as "thaqua", a term I had not heard used before. Anyone know where that word comes from?
It was also interesting to see how late in the summer this sundance was held. I will have to look back through my notes, but most other sundances for which we have dates were usually earlier, in May-June. I guess the sun dance season lasted longer than I had realized.
ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Jan 6, 2009 23:39:05 GMT -5
Kingsley:
Bruce reviewed the above biographies and suggested a correction to the reference regarding the No Eats Dog band. It was passed along to him as a jest between individuals. I modified my original footnote 10 to reflect that.
ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Jan 6, 2009 11:48:21 GMT -5
Happy holidays, everyone.
Kingsley, the additional information you provided convinces me that you are correct in your interpretation of the White Swan generations. I have tried to incorporate everything posted into the following revision of their biographies:
SWAN Magaska. Also translated as White Swan. Family name of a lineage of prominent Minnecoujou headmen during the nineteenth century. Bruce Brownwolf, a descendant of the family, noted that because the name was passed down through several generations, the historical record “tends to get confusing on which Chief White Swan a person is talking about.”1
SWAN I (c1780-c1840s?). Born about 1780, Swan was originally the leader of a Minneconjou band known as the Wipasabyapiotipi or Lodge with Black Painted Smoke Flaps.2 The Lakota wintercounts first mention Swan in 1824-25 when he lost 20 horses killed by a jealous tribal member.3 He was one of six “Siounes” (Saone) chiefs who signed the Atkinson-O’Fallon Treaty in July 18254 and was listed by cartographer Joseph Nicolette as a chief and “great orator” among the Minneconjou in 1839.5 One of his daughters, Woman Ahead of the Clouds, married fur trader Thomas Sarpy who was killed in 1832 in an accidental explosion at his trading post on Rapid Creek.6 Ethnohistorian Kingsley Bray speculates that Swan I died during the 1840s, since he was not mentioned in Thaddeus Culbertson’s 1850 list of Minneconjou bands and headmen.7
SWAN II (c1810?-1866). According to the Minneconjou White Bull, six new chiefs were recognized among the Minneconjou in 1853, including White Swan. If Bray’s suggestion that Swan I died in the 1840s is correct, the reappearance of the family name among the Minneconjou leadership suggests that this was a different individual, most likely a son. Based on the age of his children, Swan II was probably born sometime around 1810, rising to his leadership role by the time he was in his forties. He married Blue Cloud perhaps about 1836 and had six children, including three sons -- Swan III, Fine Weather, and Puts on His Shoes -- and two daughters, who later married the noted Sihasapa headman John Grass. White Bull noted that of the Minneconjou leaders, Swan “in particular hated the whites,” citing an incident in which drunken soldiers looted his lodge as the cause of his distrust and adding that he fought the Americans in a number of battles. The headman’s political views were portrayed very differently by another Minneconjou named Spotted Blue Body who mentioned that White Swan counseled against conflict with the Americans. White Swan died in December 1866 of natural causes on the Powder River, a few days before the famous Fetterman Fight. According to Spotted Blue Body: “The chief, on his death bed, called his people together and said: ‘I have tried to keep you from fighting the whites; but now I am going to die. If you want to fight the whites, collect together and go out and satisfy yourselves - fight them once more.’” White Bull’s recounting of White Swan’s final speech relates a very different tone: “Friends, you must look out for yourselves and protect your people. Try to kill white men, for the white men have come here to kill you.”8 Swan’s death in 1866 is also noted in the family wintercount.9
SWAN III (c1838-1900). Also known as Little Swan; later known as Paul Swan. Born about 1838, he was the eldest son of Swan II and his wife Blue Cloud. He is mentioned as having participated in the Fetterman Fight in 1866 shortly after the death of his father. The family name is not among the signatories of the Treaty of 1868, however, by 1869, he appears to have taken his father’s name and assumed the leadership of the family band. Modern oral history suggests that Swan’s tiyospaye may have been the Glaglaheca band.10
Swan and his band came in to the Cheyenne River Agency on the Missouri River shortly after it was established. In October 1869, he left in an effort to convince other Minneconjou to settle at the agency but he returned in February 1870 empty handed, saying that the Oglala had swayed the peace talks. General Stanley described him as “a superior Indian, and has always been faithful.”11 About 1870, Swan allowed his family wintercount to be copied by a surgeon from the adjacent military post.12 He traveled to Washington D.C. as a delegate in 1870, was recorded on the agency rolls in 1871, and listed by the agent as one of the men engaged in farming and raising livestock by 1872.13 In January 1875, Swan was recorded as leader of a band of about 20 lodges at the Cheyenne River Agency.14
As the government attempted to negotiate for the Black Hills, Swan was one of the Minneconjou headmen selected to represent the tribes’ views as a delegate to Washington in 1875. In the spring of 1876, a portion of Swan’s band left the agency to hunt and visit relatives among the northern bands. Family oral history asserts that all three brothers -- White Swan, Fine Weather, and Puts on His Shoes -- were with the northern bands and fought at the Battles of Rosebud and the Little Bighorn. If Swan was in the north in June 1876, he must have quickly returned to the agency, for he spoke at a council in late July. [insert summary of his comments.] That fall as the Army prepared to seize the Indian ponies and firearms, a number of Minneconjou including Touch the Clouds, Bull Eagle and Spotted Elk fled the agency. Swan however endeavored to persuade his relatives to remain. By October 1876, his band was listed with just 9 families. The agent noted that he “claims to be a reformed and good Indian.”15
In October 1876, the treaty commissioners met at Cheyenne River to again discuss signing away the Black Hills. Swan spoke at the council, urging a cessation to the fighting. “Some of the Great Father’s people [soldiers] went into that country, and by going there they have left the bones of both white and red people lying on the prairies,” he commented. “I do not believe the Great Spirit is satisfied with that, and when I look at you I am in hopes that you will settle this thing and have no more of it.” He shared his band’s feelings about the new proposed boundary and stated emphatically that they did not wish to move to Indian Territory. Swan also asked that their cattle not be butchered prior to their issue so that some of them could be kept to build up the tribal herd. At the end of the treaty discussions, the commissioners agreed to leave out the provision for the Lakota removal to Indian Territory. The chiefs then came forward, including Swan, and signed the document.16 [What was Swan’s role in the surrenders in 1877?] Swan lived the remainder of life on Cheyenne River Reservation as a vocal spokesman and prominent leader. He expressed deep dissatisfaction over the land negotiations in 1888 that would decrease the size of the reservation. “I don’t want to make trouble,” he commented at one of the councils, “and for the people’s sake shall advise peace.” He traveled to Washington, D.C. with the 1889 delegation to advocate the needs of the tribe, calling for tribal members to be employed at the agency instead of whites and that the contracts for hay, wood and beef be opened to the tribe as well. He asked for more schools on the reservation and called for compensation for the ponies seized by the army in 1876. During the Ghost Dance troubles, he advocated Big Foot’s band be brought in and disarmed.17
Swan married about 1870 [wife’s name?] and had several sons, including Edward (born c1872); Douglas (b. c1877) and James (b. c1881). Following the death of his first wife, he remarried about 1890 to Hinzin (later known as Mary Swan). Swan’s band settled in a community located north of the agency near the mouth of the Cheyenne River. Paul Swan died September 30, 1900.18
SWAN IV Edward Swan (c1872-1934). Paul Swan’s eldest son, Edward, continued in the family role as a Minneconjou leader. Born about 1872 on the Cheyenne River Reservation, he enlisted in the Army’s Indian scouts at Fort Bennett during the Ghost Dance troubles in 1890. Edward Swan attended college and following the death of his father, was looked to as one of the next generation of Minneconjou leaders. In 1904, Ed Swan served as chairman of the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe. He traveled to Washington, D.C. several times advocating better conditions for his people, including a trip in 1912. Swan was offered an administrative position in Washington but turned it down to remain at Cheyenne River where he believed he could be most effective. Ed Swan died June 24, 1934.19
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1. Correspondence with author, Mar. 3, 2007.
2. Josephine Waggoner papers, Museum of the Fur Trade.
3. Candace S. Greene and Russell Thornton, The Year the Stars Fell: Lakota Winter Counts at the Smithsonian (Lincoln: University of Nebraska Press) p. 175-176.
4. Kappler, Indian Affairs: Laws and Treaties, p. 231.
5. Edmund C. Bray and Martha Coleman Bray, Joseph N. Nicollet and the Plains and Prairies: The Expeditions of 1838-39 With Journals, Letters, and Notes on the Dakota Indians (St. Paul: Minnesota Historical Society Press, 1976) p. 260. Raymond J. DeMallie, Jr., “Joseph N. Nicolett’s Account of the Sioux and Assiniboin in 1839,” South Dakota History, vol. 5 (Fall 1975), p. 353.
6. Bruce Brownwolf, correspondence with author. Isaac H. Chase and George M. Platt, “The Missouri River Fur Trade: Thomas L. Sarpy and the Oglala Post,” South Dakota Review, vol. 2 (Spring 1965) pp. 25-39. Mary Pierpoint, “Women of Destiny: Generations of Matriarchs,” part 2. Sarpy’s two daughters later married noted traders Basil Claymore (Clement) and Paul Narcelle.
7. Thaddeus A. Culbertson, “Journal of an Expedition to the Mauvaises Terres and the Upper Missouri in 1850,” Bureau of American Ethnology Bulletin 147 (Washington, D.C.: Government Printing Office, 1952) p. 136.
8. The Minneconjou chiefs listed were: Brave Bear, Makes Room, White Hollow Horn, Black Shield, Lone Horn and White Swan, with two lesser (“vice chiefs”) also noted, Lame Deer and Fire Thunder. Box 105 Folder 27 p. 38, Campbell Papers; published in: Stanley Vestal, Warpath: The True Story of the fight Sioux Told in a Biography of Chief White Bull (Boston: Houghton Mifflin, 1934) p. 51. White Bull gave a second list of Minneconjou chiefs similar to this except that Brave Bear was replaced by Flying By and Fire Thunder by Black Moon. This second list may represent the chiefs as of 1866. James H. Howard, The Warrior Who Killed Custer (Lincoln: University of Nebraska Press, 1968) p. 31-32. Records Relating to the Investigation of the Fort Philip Kearney (or Fetterman) Massacre, 1866-67 (M740 Roll 1) p. 174-78.
9. Greene and Thornton, The Year the Stars Fell, p. 26-27. When his wife Blue Cloud died in 1903, the family gave the date of her husband’s death as 1877 instead of 1866. This may have been a typographical error when the document was typed up or perhaps recalled in error. At least four sources confirm his death in 1866.
10. Chris Ravenshead, correspondence with Kingsley Bray. Robert Chasing Hawk, correspondence with Bruce Brownwolf. Chasing Hawk recalled joking references between his parents as to the Eat No Dog band but this may have just been in jest.
11. Stanley to Sheridan, Feb. 12, 1870, quote in New York Times, Mar. 8, 1870.
12. Garrick Mallery, “On the Pictographs of the North American Indians,” Fourth Annual Report of the Bureau of Ethnology (Washington, D.C.: Government Printing Office, 1886) pp. 93-94
13. New York Times, July 8, July 9, July 15, 1870. Koues to CoIA, Dec. 5, 1871, Letters Received by the CoIA (M234 Roll 127 Index 209-215); Bingham to CoIA, Dec. 6, 1872 (ibid., Index 275-282).
14. Cheyenne River Agency census, Jan. 1875, CoIA Letters Received, NA.
15. New York Times, May 19, 1875. Military census, 1876-77, Fort Bennett records, NA. The military census for Sept. 1876 lists Puts on His Moccasins as a “surrendered hostile” followed by a second “hostile” named Makes Him Walk, very possibly another name for Fine Weather (these two individuals are about the same age.) Fine Weather is listed at the agency in Dec. 1876. Finally, a widow named Blue Cloud, possibly Swan II’s wife, is listed as surrendering at Cheyenne River in February 1877. With the exception of Swan, the 1876 register compliments the family oral history that the brothers were with the northern bands at the Little Bighorn.
16. Kappler, Indian Affairs: Laws and Treaties. Report and journal of proceedings of the commission appointed to obtain certain concessions from the Sioux Indians, Ex. Doc. #9, 44th Congress, 2nd session, p. 63-64.
17. Cheyenne River Agency Census Records, 1886-1900, National Archives. 1900 Federal Census, Cheyenne River Agency (T623 R1555) p. 217a. New York Times, Dec. 13, 1890. Donovin A. Sprague, Cheyenne River Sioux, South Dakota (Arcadia, 2003) p. 30.
18. Mary Swan had been previously married to Two Shields, an Upper Yanktonai from the Standing Rock Agency interviewed by Frances Desmore (Teton Sioux Music, Bureau of American Ethnology, Bulletin 61 (1918; reprinted Lincoln: University of Nebraska Press, 1992). Chris Ravenshead, correspondence with Kingsley Bray.
19. Register of Enlistments, Indian Scouts, entry 1555. South Dakota Death Index. Bruce Brownwolf, correspondence with author.
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Post by ephriam on Dec 25, 2008 0:25:52 GMT -5
Merry Christmas everyone. Looking forward to continuing conversations and new discoveries in the coming year!
ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Dec 22, 2008 17:41:09 GMT -5
Kingsley: Have you found the original source for the death of White Swan in 1866 in the Campbell Papers? I just wanted to doublecheck that source as well. So far, I have only found a couple of references to the death of a Minneconjou chief in 1866. In each case so far, the name of the chief has not been listed: - "One of the chiefs was sick and about to die so he told them to watch and encourage the Indians and wanted them to protect themself [themselves]. He died before the [Fetterman] fight started." (Box 105 Folder 22 p. 29)
- 1866, Year 100 White Men Killed "This same year one of the 6 chiefs died."(Box 105 Folder 27 p. 37)
- Paul White Swan is identified as the "son of one of the six chiefs." (Box 105 Folder 28 p. 24)
Have I missed it? ephriam
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Post by ephriam on Dec 16, 2008 4:55:08 GMT -5
Thank you, Kingsley, for the clarification and additional information. Just a few comments to see if we can resolve our differences about the Swan generations. Lets move backwards from where we agree:
Swan III (also known as Paul Swan), born circa. 1836-38; died 1900. We both agree. I think you are right that he was the one who went to Washington, D.C. in 1870 and 1875. When I was getting ready to attach the photographs to my piece above, I also noticed that the age of the individual in the 1870 and 1875 photos did not seem to fit my original interpretation and so began to wonder if I had something wrong. And I missed that the Swan listed in the Cheyenne River Agency census book for 1876 gave his age as 45, clearly making him also the Paul Swan. I had made an assumption that it was Paul's father who was at the agency in the summer of 1876 who was willing to go out and talk the non-treaty bands. But you are right, it was probably Paul Swan. I will fix that.
The family however does have an oral history that Paul Swan and his two brothers, Fine Weather and Puts on His Shoes, were at the Little Bighorn. If this is true, they must have returned to Cheyenne River very soon after the battle. (We should note that this same controversy surrounds Touch the Clouds; one family oral history claims he was at the LBH though he is not mentioned by any of the published witnesses, with the possible exception of Flying By; if Touch the Clouds was at the LBH, he must have returned quickly as he spoke at the same council that Swan did in late July 1876.) I will recheck with the family about Swan and his brothers at the Little Bighorn.
I have a copy of the probate record for Amanda Grass (wife of John Grass) which also states that she was a sister of Paul Swan, Fine Weather and Puts on His Shoes. Her original name was Walks For A Shell. I was told by the family that "there was another sister who married John Grass also" but they did not have any information on her. I suspect that this second wife may be another sister of Paul Swan listed in the heirship records as Red Cow who is reported to have died in 1874.
I also agree that Leaf's band reported in the 1876 Cheyenne River Agency census was probably a sub-group of Swan's band. Notice that Leaf and at least two other families from his band in the 1876 census are listed under Swan in the 1875 list.
Swan II (c1810-1877). While Swan died early in the agency period, his wife Blue Cloud survived well into the reservation period. She received an allotment. When she died in 1903, there was a "Report of Heirship" prepared which lists all her children, including Paul Swan, Fine Weather, etc. This is the document that I used that stated that she had been married to White Swan and that he had died in 1877.
You suggest that the father of Paul Swan was the headman reported by White Bull to have died in 1866. I don't know how to reconcile the two different dates. One of them could be wrong or they could be referring to two different people.
I assumed they represented two different people. The heirship report stated that Paul Swan was the oldest child. Since he was born about 1836-38 (census records differ by a few years), I took a guess that his father might have been 25 or so when he married Blue Cloud, so this put his birth at roughly 1810. But it was just a guess. And with the new information you provided from the Waggoner papers that puts the first Swan's year of birth at about 1780, this fits well, making Swan I about 30 when his son was born.
Swan I -- I understand your reasoning for suggesting that the first White Swan may have died in the 1840s, but what if he was just missed by Culbertson in his 1850 listing. If this Swan was the one that White Bull mentions who died in 1866, that would put his age at the time at about 86 years old, very old for this period but not impossible.
So with what both you and I have found, I think the Swan generations probably went:
Swan I (c1780-1866) Swan II (c1810?-1877) Swan III (c1836/38-1900) [=Paul Swan] Swan IV (c1873-1934) [=Edward Swan]
This puts roughly 30 years between each generation which seems reasonable.
Ephriam
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