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Red Dog
Nov 5, 2008 11:08:51 GMT -5
Post by Dietmar on Nov 5, 2008 11:08:51 GMT -5
I have transfered this question of Charlie from the littlebighorn.info boards: Red Dog (Sunka Luta): date of birth 1833 (?). At which band of birth of the Hunkpapa he belonged? Why he became a chief of the Oyukpe (ha married a Red Cloud's sister, that was a Ite Sica, not Oyukpe...). When he dead? Kingsleybray said 1886, the last image posted by Dietmar is dated 1907 (!) (by Curtis). Can any Sioux's experts answer to my questions? Thanks. What I already can say is that the Curtis photo of 1907 is most probably Red Dog´s son, who took the name after his father´s death.
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Post by ephriam on Nov 6, 2008 3:01:41 GMT -5
Charlie:
The information about Red Dog's background came from his grandson, William Fills the Pipe, who said: "My grandfather was originally a Hunkpapa, but he married a Oyuhpe woman and stayed all together with the Oyuhpes." (quoted in letter from John Colhoff to Joseph Balmer, circa. 1949-50, courtesy Kingsley Bray)
I have seen mention that Red Dog married a sister of Red Cloud, but I have not been able to find the original source for that detail to verify.
According to William Fills the Pipe, Red Dog died about 1881 or 1882.
Red Dog had several prominent sons who lived into the early reservation period at Pine Ridge. The eldest (b. c1848-49) took his father's name. His other two sons were Kills a Hundred and Fills the Pipe. By 1890, these sons were the core group of a band known as the Makaicu (19 families/83 people) at Pine Ridge. I assume this is the elder Red Dog's original band.
ephriam
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Post by charlie on Nov 6, 2008 6:12:12 GMT -5
Ok Ephriam: now, i labelled him so: Oyuhpe band - Makaicu clan - Oglala subdivision.
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Red Dog
Dec 21, 2008 13:40:18 GMT -5
Post by jinlian on Dec 21, 2008 13:40:18 GMT -5
I've found this new Red Dog photograph in the Smithsonian Archives online - it has been obviously taken in the same period (late 1870s) and by the same photograph who took the Red Cloud photograph I've recently uploaded in the "Chief Red Cloud" thread.
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Red Dog
Dec 22, 2008 5:07:14 GMT -5
Post by Dietmar on Dec 22, 2008 5:07:14 GMT -5
Jinlian,
Again an excellent portrait!
Look at the catridge belt... reminds me of the Mitchell photo of Red Dog.
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Red Dog
Apr 28, 2009 14:34:46 GMT -5
Post by W. Smoke on Apr 28, 2009 14:34:46 GMT -5
Well on Chief Red Dog;
Red Dog was the father of Red Shirt.
Red Shirt aka Bear Hunts Himself was the father of Henry.
Henry Red Shirt was the father of John & Charles.
John & Charles Red Shirt were brothers.
Irene & Mable Red Shirt were first cousins.
I know this because my grandmothers are Irene & Mable.
My mother Bertha Smoke’s mother was Irene.
Chief Red Dog was a main headman of a Wounded Knee District’s band called Oyukpe.
Chief Red Shirt & Two Bull was the headmen of the Ogle Luta People at the Stronghold.
Contact W. Smoke
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Post by Dietmar on May 1, 2009 9:39:07 GMT -5
Thank you Wendyll! I remember a discussion about Red Shirt, when Ephriam stated that there were several Red Shirts, who are often confused. Please look here: www.american-tribes.com/Lakota/BIO/RedShirt.htmCan we confirm which Red Shirt is the son of Red Dog? Thanks.
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Red Dog
May 1, 2009 10:38:27 GMT -5
Post by kingsleybray on May 1, 2009 10:38:27 GMT -5
One of Red Dog's sons was called Red Shirt, but it's not the famous Red Shirt, the handsome one. I think the latter, the Loafer band chief who travelled with Buffalo Bill, was actually a half-breed.
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Red Dog
May 1, 2009 15:09:25 GMT -5
Post by W. Smoke on May 1, 2009 15:09:25 GMT -5
Yes it is the famous Oglala Chief Red Shirt!
My uncle Wilmer Mesteth confirmed "that he was the son old chief Red Dog!"
Wilmer's mother is a Red Shirt & he is a well-respected Spiritual leader among our people of today!
Contact: W. Smoke
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Red Dog
Sept 26, 2010 9:04:36 GMT -5
Post by brighteyes on Sept 26, 2010 9:04:36 GMT -5
Red Shirt WAS NOT half white. He was half Brule and half Oglala
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Red Dog
Sept 26, 2010 14:57:58 GMT -5
Post by ephriam on Sept 26, 2010 14:57:58 GMT -5
I think there is still some confusion about the three different Oglala men named Red Shirt who settled on the Pine Ridge Reservation. Perhaps it will help to share a little more information using their later reservation names:
1. Adam Red Shirt (c1846-15 Oct 1906). Recorded in He Dog's Soreback Band in 1890, in the White Clay District. His son Guy received an allotment in the Slim Buttes area.
2. Joseph Red Shirt (c1847-4 Jan 1925). This is the Oglala whose father was a white man and his mother a Lakota. I think he originally grew up among the Kiyuksa or Southern Oglala but shifted over to the Wagluhe after his marriage. He is recorded in the Wagluhe Band in 1890, in the Wakpamni District. He is the one who traveled for some years with Buffalo Bill's Wild West Show and for whom there are a number of photographs.
3. Henry Red Shirt (c1859-30 Aug 1934). This is the "son" of Red Dog; "brother" of Silas Fills the Pipe and John Kills a Hundred. Wendy Smoke above has listed Henry as the son of Red Shirt and the grandson of Red Dog. But I believe the Red Shirt and the Henry Red Shirt she refers to are the same person. Henry and his wife Emma had several children, including John (b. 1882), Charles and Alfred (b. 1895). Alfred appears to have remained single but the other two sons married and had a number of children, with number of descendants in that community today.
I am particularly interested in learning more about Henry Red Shirt. He and Fred Two Bulls were recognized as leaders in the Red Shirt Table community, located on the Cheyenne River in the northwest corner of the reservation. Some of the families had moved into this area by 1904. Many received allotments here in 1910. By 1920, there were at least 10 families in this small community, including Silas Fills the Pipe who served as the catechist in the Catholic church there, St. Bernard's Chapel. There was also Christ Church (Episcopal) and a day school in this community. This community was built around the sons of Red Dog. In the late 1930s, this community was site of the Red Shirt Developmental Project or Red Shirt Table Cooperative.
ephriam
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Red Dog
Nov 10, 2010 11:05:47 GMT -5
Post by miller7513 on Nov 10, 2010 11:05:47 GMT -5
Trying to find someone who has info on “The He” listed in Crazy Horse Surrender Ledger listed with him Red Dog, Black Eyes and Fills The Pipe Thanks LaDeane Miller
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Red Dog
Oct 13, 2011 11:56:10 GMT -5
Post by Dietmar on Oct 13, 2011 11:56:10 GMT -5
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Red Dog
Oct 13, 2011 12:07:21 GMT -5
Post by Dietmar on Oct 13, 2011 12:07:21 GMT -5
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Red Dog
Mar 23, 2014 7:16:03 GMT -5
Post by ephriam on Mar 23, 2014 7:16:03 GMT -5
Interview with Red Dog's son, Poor Bear, who later took on his father's name. From the Meany Papers: Wounded Knee Manderson S.D. 21 July 1907 John Monroe, Interpreter Red Dog Shun-ka-Luta Ogalala 60 years old 16 years old when he first went on the warpath. It was against the Crows. Sitting Bull was leader. Two Crows were killed and one Sioux. He never led a war party. He was in only one battle. He never counted coup. He served as scout under a general the Indians called Rock. He considers Sitting Bull the greatest leader of his people and General Miles of the whites. His father bore the same name. Red Dog's name before was Poor Bear. Edward Curtis' portrait of Red Dog (Poor Bear), 1907.
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