Post by kingsleybray on Oct 16, 2008 15:09:38 GMT -5
Great photo, Dietmar. No, that's not correct, jinlian, Big Road's son Chase Alone (Ishna Wakuwa) was married to Red Cloud's youngest daughter Tells Him (born ca. 1860), later known as Fannie Chase Alone. So Big Road (born 1834) and Red Cloud became related through marriage as omahinton (a reciprocal relationship between the parents of a married couple).
thank you, I did know about Tells Him being married to Chase Alone; I was also sure Stevens didn't get the information from the census data (he calls the wife of Big Road "daughter of Red Cloud" without giving her personal name, which never happens in census records). I was asking because I wasn't sure something like that - I mean, a man marrying a sister or cousin of his daughter-in-law - could happen in Lakota society. Among the Apsaroka it would have been a taboo, sort of incest...but among the Lakotas?
I have seen this photo of C.G. Morledge published several times in books on the events at Wounded Knee in 1890/1. Included in this picture are left to right:
- C. H. Cressey, Omaha Bee correspondent; - William F. Kelley, Nebraska State Journal; - Major John Burke, (general manager of Buffalo Bill Cody's Wild West show); - an unidentified Native American man, - Alfred Burkholder, New York Herald; Chamberlain, South Dakota Gazette; and - Charles W. Allen, editor of the Chadron Democrat and on New York Herald payroll.
From this close-up I would assume that the unidentified Indian is Big Road:
Here is an interview with Big Road's son, Chase Alone, who was born about 1863 and died some time between 1910 and 1913. As noted above, Chase Alone married about 1885 to Red Cloud's daughter; she was later known as Fannie Chase Alone.
One of the interesting comments in this short interview is that he took over his father's leadership role and that Black Fox had been the leader prior to Big Road. This suggests a chronology of band leaders for the True Oyuhpe as: Black Fox, 1860s-70s; Big Road, 1870s-1890s; Chase Along 1890s to 1910s. I am not certain yet who filled this role after that. Also note that he refers to John Red Dog as a cousin, indicating a family relationship between the Big Road and Red Dog families among the Oyuhpe.
Wounded Knee Manderson, S.D. 19 July 1907 Joseph Pourier, Interpreter
Big Road Chan-ku-Ton ka 40 years old Ogalala
Before his father's death his name was "Charges Alone." His father was chief of the Wounded Knee band and bore the name of Big Road. Before Big Road the chief was Black Fox.
He never was in a war party but got his name from a deed of his father.
The buffalo were not gone when he was a young man and he took part in buffalo hunts. When 15 holding horses on the prairie a herd of buffalo came. He and his companion chased and with arrows killed two young buffaloes.
On another occasion there was a big party including two of his uncles. They had extra horses and he was taken along to help care for those horses. They started the chase. He went on slow leading two horses. He met an old fellow butchering a buffalo. He got off and got a piece of liver to eat. In the meantime a wounded buffalo cow came that way. He did not see it until it bumped him over and he crawled into the carcass. His uncles came and shot the cow and rescued the boy who was all smeared with blood. The uncles had shot the cow with arrows. When they approached she got up and took after one of the uncles striking the horse and cutting a gash in its thigh.
On another occasion he and four other boys took after a stray buffalo. They shot all their arrows into the buffalo except one lone arrow which he had. He wanted to make a sure shot at close range. He got so close that the buffalo took after him. There was some timber near and he tried to get to the timber but his horse got tangled in vines and threw him off. The buffalo was close behind. He scrambled behind a tree and commenced to climb the tree. The buffalo staid there all day and he was kept in the tree. The other boys went to the village and reported when one of the men came out and killed the buffalo. In the excitement he lost that precious arrow. John Red Dog, his cousin, was the one who killed the buffalo. They went back to cut up the buffalo. A creek had swollen while away and while wading the water came up to his mouth so he dropped the meat and escaped drowning.
He fasted on a hill near his home one day and a night. He laid down facing the west. It seemed as though a man approached. He heard footsteps. When it got close he raised up and saw it was a black spider with yellow spots on its sides. Right behind him there seemed some one whispering. He looked up and saw a couple of magpies. He laid down again and he heard a woman speaking, saying: "Young man get up. Go and catch it." So he got up and looked towards the place. It was rather dark but he could plainly see a horse tied up near him. Several days afterward there was a fine horse given to him.
His father died 15 years ago since when he has been chief. The Indians assembled around the Omaha house and elected him chief in his father's place.
Post by kingsleybray on Mar 19, 2014 4:59:40 GMT -5
According to Eagle Elk's interview with Donald Collier, Big Road's father was White Plume. This is the chief met by Lt Warren at Inyan Kara in Sept. 1857 - 'bird's down'. As White Feather, noted as a retired Oglala chief, he signed the treaty of Ft Sully Oct. 1865 with the Miniconjous. As Flying Feather he is noted as the first Oyuhpe chief in 1867 (CoIA AR 1867, information from G.P. Beauvais). Not mentioned after that date to my knowledge.
Wood Leg told Fr Buechel in 1915 that the first Oyuhpe chief (i.e. that he could remember) was Mato inazin, lit. Bears Comes and Stands. As Standing Bear he is mentioned a couple of times in the decade 1856-68. He "was followed by" Big Road.
So we have at least three eminent Oyuhpe leaders in the slot 1856-67: White Plume, Black Fox, Bear Comes and Stands. Big Road was considered a (or the) successor of each of these three.The He Dog interview with Eleanor Hinman indicates he became a 'chief' (a shirt wearer? or a Decider?) in 1868, at the same time as He Dog (for the Bad Face band).
Post by kingsleybray on Mar 19, 2014 7:00:43 GMT -5
Red Warbonnet in his interview says that Standing Bear, i.e. the Oyuhpe chief Bear Comes and Stands (Mato-hinazhin), was his brother. This seems to mean he is another son (or 'son') of Shoulder, the Oglala signatory to the 1825 treaty.
A few notes about relationships between Red War Bonnet-Whirlwind Track-Standing Bear:
1. In McLaughlin's 1881 list of Oglala at the Standing Rock Agency, he lists Standing Bear immediately following White Plume (a name associated with the Big Road family).
2. In the Sitting Bull Surrender Census, 1881, White Feather [=White Plume] is listed in Family 496, age 26 (born about c1855). Is this a brother of Big Road, who took on their father's name? Among his family members is a nephew named Poor Thunder. This could be Red War Bonnet's son, Poor Thunder.
3. In the next family (#497) is a man named Surrendered in Water (b. c1830) and his wife Fisher Woman and a daughter named White Face. This may be the same family listed in the 1890 census, in the true Oyuhpe band, as Standing Bear (b. c1829) with a wife Fisher Woman and a daughter named Face. He is of the right age to be the brother of Red War Bonnet, but could also be a later male relative.
4. In the 1890 census, there is a second younger man named Standing Bear (b. c1856), just three families away from the elder Standing Bear; presumably the two are related in some way. This younger Standing Bear (c1859-1933) was interviewed several times, including by Eli Ricker, Edmond Meany, Walter Camp, and finally by John G. Neihardt. He told Neihardt that he was born on the Tongue River in the Winter When the Children Died of Coughing (1859).
5. Red War Bonnet mentioned a brother named Whirlwind Track. This is very likely the same person mentioned by Black Elk (DeMallie, The Sixth Grandfather, p. 149-150) as Whirlwind Chaser, whom he described as this younger Standing Bear's uncle. According to Black Elk, Whirlwind Chaser was "Standing Bear's mother's brother" and a noted medicine man.
Still hunting but clearly the White Plume-Big Road family is related to the Red War Bonnet-Whirlwind Track-Standing Bear family.
Last Edit: Mar 19, 2014 20:59:52 GMT -5 by ephriam
Post by kingsleybray on Mar 20, 2014 3:15:47 GMT -5
Hau, Ephriam, I also began to think yesterday is Whirlwind Track the same man as Whirlwind Chaser from the Black Elk accounts.
I think I posted this on the Wakan band thread, but Alex White Plume (direct descendant, of course) told me in 2005 that White Plume married a daughter of Red Horn Bull and his wife Good Woman. This daughter was Fannie White Plume. Their son Robert White Plume was born in 1885. Robert was Alex White Plume's paternal grandfather.
So, from the 1890 census we have the family of White Plume (age 38 - born c. 1852) including a son 4 years old, Shot At. Is this Robert?
White Plume's wife is Hip Woman, age 39, born c. 1851. In the SITTING BULL SURRENDER CENSUS, White Plume/White Feather is age 26 (born c. 1854), while his wife is Cheyenne Woman, age 27. Again, she is one year older as in 1890, so it looks like the same woman. (Incidentally,her Lakota name is given as Sa-hun-win-la - I wonder if it signifies not Cheyenne Woman, but rather Saone Woman?)
Alex said that White Plume's father was called Surrounded Bear, his mother Red Bird (Red Wing in another conversation).He also said that Surrounded Bear was a brother of Red Warbonnet. Their family way back used to live round Green Grass (on Moreau river).
Post by kingsleybray on Mar 20, 2014 4:15:41 GMT -5
I'm 'getting' a possible marriage or cluster of marriages linking the White Plume-Big Road family to the Standing Bear-Red Warbonnets. The latter are sons of Shoulder, and they are 'marrying in' into the True Oyuhpe.
Shoulder I see as born about the early 1780s, his sons born c. 1805-1815. The youngest of the cluster would be Red Warbonnet, born c. 1815, marries into Oyuhpe in later 1840s (as per Red Warbonnet thread).
The older sons are Whirlwind Track, maybe born by c. 1805 (a warrior in 1823)and Standing Bear, the latter being an Oyuhpe chief in the 1850s and 60s. These guys' marriages probably took place in the years either side of 1830.