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Post by grahamew on Aug 19, 2014 4:49:51 GMT -5
Unfortunately, my scanner's shot!
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Post by gregor on Aug 19, 2014 13:04:30 GMT -5
This one? Is this really Black Foot? The man on the left side seems to be the Brulé Bear Foot and the next man could be the Oglala Flat Iron. Who is the man on the right?
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Post by wolfgang on Aug 19, 2014 16:02:04 GMT -5
Hey, I would say the man right of Flat Iron is Joe Black Fox. I think this is a photo from a wild west show
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Post by gregor on Aug 20, 2014 1:32:49 GMT -5
Hi Wolfgang, I would agree!
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Post by grahamew on Aug 20, 2014 4:18:00 GMT -5
My first thought on seeing the photo was - Joe Black Fox.
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Post by wolfgang on Aug 20, 2014 5:40:23 GMT -5
A question to Joe Black Fox: Kicking Bear had two brothers, Flying Hawk and Black Fox II. Is Joe Black Fox the brother of Kicking Bear???
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 20, 2014 7:51:30 GMT -5
I agree with the identifications so far. Here´s Joe Black Fox for comparison: Joseph (Joe) Black Fox
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Post by kingsleybray on Aug 21, 2014 2:52:30 GMT -5
Great images, gregor. One of the headmen in Big Foot's camp, and likely to be with that little line of elders standing near the chief, was Wounded Hand. He was the eyapaha, the camp crier or herald. He and Horned Cloud sat next to Big Foot in the council with Forsyth and Whitside on Dec. 29, 1890, in the tense minutes before the tragedy erupted at Wounded Knee.
No known pic to compare, but could Wounded Hand be the man standing to left of Big Foot? Wearing some sort of eye glasses or goggles.
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 21, 2014 3:16:00 GMT -5
Welcome back Kingsley. This is the man with goggles in both photos:
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 21, 2014 3:19:10 GMT -5
Another interesting face is this man from the same line of men near Spotted Elk:
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Post by kingsleybray on Aug 21, 2014 3:29:30 GMT -5
Notice the man in the goggles is carrying a warclub. I thought it was some kind of staff but now I see the stone head of the club! Some kind of symbol of authority.
This is only a guess but could the face you just posted be that of Horned Cloud? As I said he sat with Big Foot in the Dec. 29 council, as if he was a senior headman or elder. Age 46 in 1881 (Sitting Bull Surremder Census p.104), so approx. 55 in 1890 (born c. 1835. In the top detail Dietmar just posted he is wearing a down plume at his forehead - possibly symbolising his status as one of the hunkayapi (hunka class).
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Post by kingsleybray on Aug 21, 2014 3:37:29 GMT -5
Chris Ravenshead, conversation with me, November 3, 1993. Hump and Horned Cloud were cousins. The mothers of Big Foot/Spotted Elk and of Horned Cloud were sisters. Horned Cloud's mother was called Brings Buckskin Horse.
So Big Foot and Horned Cloud would have addressed each other as 'brother.' Big Foot, born c. 1826, was the elder.
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 21, 2014 3:43:29 GMT -5
Well, I think there is a resemblance to Dewey Beard, even more in the 2nd picture.
Of course I´m aware that this is a bit speculative.
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Post by kingsleybray on Aug 21, 2014 4:25:00 GMT -5
Here is how Joseph Horn Cloud described the council between Big Foot's band and Col. Forsyth and Maj. Whitside, Dec. 29, 1890: "On his left was his brother, on his right was Horned Cloud, father of Joseph Horn Cloud. Just behind Big Foot stood old man Wounded Hand." Interview with Eli S. Ricker, Oct. 23, 1906, Nebraska State Hist. Soc.
Big Foot's brother may be Frog, who also left important statements about Wounded Knee.
Could these four headmen correspond to the group of elders including Big Foot in the photo here? I think "old man" Wounded Hand should be the man in the goggles. Frog might be the man in the hat.Frog was 47 years old according to the data presented in Richard Jensen's paper on Big Foot's followers (I've put in a link in a message below). So, very tentatively, left to right: Horned Cloud (age 55), Wounded Hand, Spotted Elk/Big Foot (age 64), Frog (age 47). Or should it be Frog, Wounded Hand, Big Foot, Horned Cloud?
Worth noting: Joseph Horn Cloud lists another brother of Big Foot's, Iron Eyes, as a fatality in the massacre. So he is different from Frog.
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Post by kingsleybray on Aug 21, 2014 8:21:22 GMT -5
The old warrior in blowup no. 6 looks interesting. Carries a knifeclub.
Am looking at the lists of fatalities and survivors in the Ricker interview with Joseph Horn Cloud. He lists as No. 32 of fatalities "Bear Woman, the oldest woman in the Band". Is she the old lady in the first wagon from the left, shawl draped over her head?
Among the survivors he notes "White Face Woman, the Oldest in the Band except perhaps Bear Woman".
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