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Post by gregor on Jul 24, 2014 10:04:23 GMT -5
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Post by gregor on Jul 24, 2014 10:10:28 GMT -5
Pic 4: Sole (bottom of foot) ? ? (Spotted Elk / Big Foot in background) Pic 5: Make-it-Long, Warrior ? ? Pic 6: ? ? ? Can we identify the single persons? I think here we have Big Foot / Spotted Elk himself: Toksha ake Gregor
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Post by gregor on Jul 24, 2014 11:12:37 GMT -5
Here we have additional photos of the above event: and According to the caption these peoples are (left to right): Bear-that-Runs-and-Growls, Warrior, One-Tooth-Gone, Sole (bottom of foot), Make-it-Long
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Post by hreinn on Jul 24, 2014 13:08:38 GMT -5
Thanks Gregor ! These are great scans. Gregor, for a future reference it would be good if you could number each picture (Picture 1, Picture 2, etc.). It would also be interesting to see a zoom of the persons in the back row(s) in your original photograph (in the thread Big Foot / Spotted Elk). This photograph gives us a change to honour the memory of these people, who many were massacred 4 months later at Wounded Knee. By identify each person on the photograph by their names and hopefully also their family relations. Perhaps Lakota people are willing to add some stories of the life of these persons. This photograph also gives us a change to understand better what is behind the phrases "band" and "thiospaye". Because when we read about this and that band who did this and that, we most often only know the names of few of the people in each band. Sometimes only the itancan (the chief) and sometimes his akicita(s) and sometimes famous warrior(s) and sometimes their wives. But most often we have no clue about the majority of the people in each band. The silent majority. But here we have a rare change to see at the same time most of the people of a single band. Although there are some missing, because we don't see so many very old people. Neither do we see very young children/infants. We actually know the names of most of these people. Because we know the names of many people who were: a) killed in the Wounded Knee Massacre b) survivors of the Wounded Knee Massacre With only the complicating factor that some of the people at Wounded Knee were Hunkpapa Lakota. Fleeing from Standing Rock after the killing of the Hunkpapa chief Sitting Bull and taking shelter among Mnikhówozu band of Big Foot/Spotted Elk. In Ricker's interview with Joseph Horn Cloud, a survivor of Wounded Knee Massacre. We have the names of 187 killed people and names of 104 survivors.
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Post by gregor on Jul 25, 2014 13:00:56 GMT -5
Hi hreinn, work done! Now,I hope we get the names together. But first the people in the background: Pic 7: Pic 8: Pic 9: Pic 10: Pic 11: Pic 12: Let's work! Toksha Gregor
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Post by hreinn on Jul 26, 2014 8:23:35 GMT -5
Great Gregor ! Good idea to show on the original group photo the frame of each zoom and give there the number of each picture. I was going to start with identifying Ricker's informant Joseph Horn Cloud. And then his brothers; Daniel White Lance and Iron Hail/Dewey Hawk Beard/Dewey Beard (b.1858, d.1955). From the photograph here, posted by Dietmar on June 25, 2008, showing the 3 brothers together (Joseph Horn Cloud standing): amertribes.proboards.com/thread/177/dewey-beard?page=1And then Dewey Beard's wife from the photographs here: amertribes.proboards.com/thread/177?page=2These people would have been around 30 years old in "our" picture. But I don't see them in "our" picture ! The closest to Joseph Horn Cloud's look is the one who is identified as Bear-that-Runs-and-Growls in the non-numbered picture above. Perhaps these 3 brothers belonged to another Mnikhówozu band than Mnikhówozu band of Big Foot/Spotted Elk ? Not very refreshing start !
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Post by hreinn on Jul 26, 2014 9:21:26 GMT -5
What was the name of Big Foot's band ?
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Post by hreinn on Jul 27, 2014 9:02:18 GMT -5
The person on the left in the bottow row is perhaps the same person as the one on the left in Pic 1. What do you say ? This photo is probably taken in Washington. Does anyone know the name of this person ? Spotted Elk/Big Foot is on the photo above, in the center of the top row (second from left). The one on the left in top row (left of Spotted Elk/Big Foot), is perhaps the same person as the one with a white hat in Pic 10 (right of Spotted Elk/Big Foot) ? What do you say ? What is his name ?
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Post by grahamew on Jul 27, 2014 10:58:24 GMT -5
The person on the left, bottom row, of the delegation photo is Big Head, not the man in the first picture. If you're right about the man in the white hat, he's called Little Bear.
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Post by grahamew on Jul 29, 2014 9:57:40 GMT -5
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 1, 2014 7:04:48 GMT -5
Just back from vacation, I missed your earlier posts. I like the idea of getting IDs of the people in the photo. But it will be a hard task. I would assume that the four leaders of this group stand in one row with Spotted Elk in pic 10 (just my guess): Do we know who were the most important men / chiefs in the group?
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 2, 2014 9:58:02 GMT -5
Here is the man with the white hat, standing on Spotted Elk´s left, 1. from the group photo Gregor has posted (pic 10) and 2. from the alternative shot of the same group:
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Post by gregor on Aug 3, 2014 14:34:23 GMT -5
Hi Dietmar, the man with the hat, could it be White Swan? Take a look to this detail of the Oct. 1888 photograph at washington - No. 65? See the eye area... Toksha Gregor
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Post by grahamew on Aug 16, 2014 5:11:59 GMT -5
Anyone seen the new photo of Big Foot in the Jerome Greene book about Wounded Knee?
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Post by Dietmar on Aug 17, 2014 5:43:06 GMT -5
Grahame, that sounds interesting. I haven´t seen it yet. What do you think of it? Any chance to post a sample?
Gregor, I´ve thought about it for some time, but can´t see White Swan really. It doesn´t mean I´m sure he isn´t 100 percent. It´s a blurry picture...
Btw, what about Young Spotted Elk, the son who later settled at Pine Ridge. I neither can´t find him in the photo, but he has to be there, hasn´t he?
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