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Post by traviesa2080 on Mar 4, 2013 15:02:49 GMT -5
Wow you guys have great pictures & info on here.. I am trying to help my friend look into her ancestry. She is a White Mountain Apache. I have been on ancestry.com and other sites trying to find any info I can for her. I was wondering if any of you know about John Dazen of the White Mountain tribe. I read somewhere that he was a chief. Some of the other ones I'm looking for info on are of the last names Thompson, Cosen, Riley/Friday. If anyone can help me would you please email me or reply back.. Thank you so much & for posting such great pics and info.
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Post by kayitah on Mar 5, 2013 10:28:11 GMT -5
Hello and welcome What little I know about John Dazen is that he was a tag band chief and that he served as a scout from Jan. 1884 to July 1885. Here's what Grenville Goodwin, who for some time lived with the people at Fort Apache and San Carlos, wrote about him: From Goodwin’s «The Social Organization of the Western Apache», Appendix C, Tag Bands, Fort Apache, p. 579 N. – Chief was tc’à’ndè-zn („long hat“), or John Dayzn, of clan 13; Canyon Creek, made up mostly of clans 12, 13, and 23. They all lived on Canyon Creek. The old chief died, and no one has been appointed in his place. The Arizona Historical Society even seems to have a photograph of him, but it needs to be ordered: beta.worldcat.org/archivegrid/data/46767104
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Post by kayitah on Mar 5, 2013 10:51:28 GMT -5
As for the last name "Riley", there was a rather prominent man named Sinew L. Riley. He was the son of an equally well-know scout named Dead Shot. Dead Shot, much respected by his fellow scout comrades and soldiers, held the rank of sergeant. He and two other scouts, sergeant Dandy Jim and corporal Skippy were hanged in Globe on March 3, 1882 for their actions in a controversial affair known as the Battle at Cibecue Creek or just the Cibecue Affair. Here's some more info about Sinew Riley, as well as a photograph of him with his family: www.huachuca.army.mil/files/History_ApacheScouts.pdfIn addition I have the following photograph of a scout named Riley and his wife, but I don't know for sure whether it is Sinew Riley or not, since the photograph is not dated. I will try to find out more on that matter. Attachments:
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Post by kayitah on Mar 5, 2013 11:02:14 GMT -5
Here's a better version of the above photograph. It's interesting that in the above (identical) picture, the name is written "Riley", while on this one it's "Reilly"! The photographer is Andrew Miller. From vintagephoto.com I got this information about him: "Andrew Miller, who came from Silver City, New Mexico to Globe in 1886 to photograph the Apache operated a gallery in Bisbee briefly in 1897. Ironically after photographing the end of the wild Apache years before, Miller was killed by the Yaqui in Sonora, Mexico 2 years later." Attachments:
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Post by dT on Mar 5, 2013 12:03:16 GMT -5
kayitah ... those were impressive answers, my friend. well done :-)
dT
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Post by traviesa2080 on Mar 5, 2013 17:35:16 GMT -5
Oh my goodness!!! Kayitah, thank you!! I was really wanting to find a picture of John Dazen for my friend!! That is amazing! I will def look into ordering that. Sinew Riley is in her family somewhere, I think a distant cousin maybe. The one we are most interested in is Thomas Riley or Thomas Friday also Niapaha. I found that before about 1914 he went by the last name Friday but after that he went by Riley. Kind of odd. I do have a copy of his death cert. but it has very limited info on it. With the Thompson side, I'm looking for info on Turner Thompson or Kachina. Found some stuff through ancestry.com & his death cert. is also very limited on the info. As for the Cosen side, I'm looking for Charles Cosen or Nayski. I have his death cert also very limited info. I believe they were all scouts. I haven't found the solid evidence on Kachina being a scout but the time frame fits. If you can help at all or know anything about them, we would be so greatfull!! I'm so excited to find a picture of John Dazen! Thank you so much for your kindness & info on John & Sinew!
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Post by dT on Mar 5, 2013 19:15:36 GMT -5
traviesa ... it seems as though you do have Nde (Apache) names for some of these people. Let me make a humble suggestion. Search carefully back through all the old threads here that talk about the Apache scouts. Often you will find photo's of some of these scouts. And sometimes you will find identifications of their names matching the picture. Take a careful look. You may find who you are wanting to identify.
dT
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Post by traviesa2080 on Mar 5, 2013 19:36:27 GMT -5
Hi DT, I have done all that before I tried to post here. I couldn't find any of the names in the scouts. It was a good thought & I will go through them again. Thank you!!
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Post by dT on Mar 5, 2013 22:24:16 GMT -5
traviesa ... OK looks like you need specific info from White Mtn folks. they are active here - so be patient :-)
dT
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Post by traviesa2080 on Mar 6, 2013 11:29:09 GMT -5
Thanks DT... =)
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Post by traviesa2080 on Mar 7, 2013 10:58:00 GMT -5
Hi guys, I was able to get the pics of John Dazen from the Arizona Historical Society & I would like to share them with you. There are 3 pics of him and in 2 he is with Alchasay. How do I post them so you guys can take a look??
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Post by naiches2 on Mar 7, 2013 14:13:21 GMT -5
Article about Sinew Riley can find here: uair.arizona.edu/item/262848and here (with photo): www.defense.gov/specials/nativeam02/signew.htmlRiley, Staff Sergeant SinewStaff Sgt. Sinew Riley was the ranking Apache scout at Huachuca in the 30s and 40s. From the Whiteriver Reservation, Riley was a third generation scout. His grandfather was Dead Shot who had been hanged in 1883 for the Cibicue mutiny. Riley, a 1910 graduate of the Phoenix Indian School, lived with his second wife, known only as is Mamma, and his sixteen children in the little Indian village on the northwest side of Huachuca Creek just across from the housing area which would become known as Apache Flats. He had enlisted in1920. During World War II when Fort Huachucawas transformed into a training base for black infantry divisions, Riley encountered draftees for the first time. He wrote to his son Larrie, who had complained to him about not getting a furlough: ie...You remember that you are in the Army now. ...Being upset will get you nowhere. ...Most soldiers are that way when they get drafted in the Army now days. Us Veteran Old Soldiers are different way about it. We take it whatever it is. Whether we are getting Pass or not. ...A man must act like a man when he get in the Army. He do not get upset because they turn him down or canceled his Furlough. They had to do that.... veteran knows that, its an order. Thats part of the Army Regulation. If not, the Army is not worth a Dam. ...It takes a good man to be a good soldier. Sergeant Riley knew that the Apache scouts were at the end of their usefulness as an Army unit. He regretted that he could not get in on the fighting in Europe and the Pacific. He wrote, irAs for me I am Old for Service, only good for home Guard.l, The Apache scouts were getting up in years in 1944. One lieutenant stationed at Huachuca in World War II said they sometimes needed help to mount their horses. But they still rode the forts perimeters keeping the fences in repair, tended livestock, and acted as the postªs Service Company, doing odd jobs of carpentry and blacksmithing. And they also participated in parades. The detachment of Indian scouts at Fort Huachuca was disbanded by direction of the Army on November 30, 1943. That meant that the scouts were carried only as a local Fort Huachuca unit known as Detachment Indian Scouts, Service Command Unit 1922. With the closure of the post in September 1947, there was no place in the Army for the last of the Apache scouts, so the detachment was disbanded on September 30, 1947, and the last four scouts officially retired in the grade of staff sergeant. SSgt. Riley died of appendicitis in 1960.
Here is Riley Senior's image from Cowan's auction: (with imprint, E. M. Jennings, Photographs, Prescott, Arizona, & ms. id., Riley the scout and his wives and their house, verso; ca. 1880s)Attachments:
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Post by dT on Mar 7, 2013 15:01:34 GMT -5
amazing. The US Army should have used the skills of those men much more than they did. There was a wealth of knowledge at Fort Huachaca that was never really utilized. Such a shame.
dT
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Post by traviesa2080 on Mar 7, 2013 16:33:47 GMT -5
Thanks naiches2 for that article & the picture.
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Post by traviesa2080 on Mar 7, 2013 16:37:57 GMT -5
Here's one of the pics that I was able to get from the AZ Historical Society of John Dazen. Attachments:
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