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Post by kakarns on Oct 8, 2017 4:20:41 GMT -5
Lynnette, Can you tell me where (what Thread) you found the error ? It will make it easier for me to correct. Sorry about the error. Thanks, kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Oct 8, 2017 4:57:25 GMT -5
Hello, Since 9-23-13 I have been collecting information about the Native Americans that may have lived near Rocky Ford, Colorado in the year of Pecokawin's birth, March 17, 1864. I have no solid proof at this time but, most of the information I have been finding suggests it was more probable it was the Cheyenne and Arapaho Peoples. Therefore, I have had to look at a bigger picture so to speak, knowing that Charging Eagle ended up settling at Medicine Root Creek in South Dakota. The biggest question in the back of my mind is perhaps, was Charging Eagle in Rocky Ford because he married into the Cheyenne or Arapaho family or, was he originally from the Cheyenne or, Arapaho Peoples ? 1.) On the "THIRTEENTH CENSUS OF THE UNITED STATES: INDIAN POPULATION, Medicine Root District, May of 1910" list the following information: Charging Eagle - Head - age 76 - Place of Birth of this Person, North Dakota - Place of Birth of Father of this Person, Colorado - Place of Birth of Mother of this Person, North Dakota. This information was a good start for me in my research. I must say that the year this Census was taken, Charging Eagle would enter the Spirit World, 7 months later. So, considering Charging Eagle gave the birth place of himself and his Mother in North Dakota and his Father from Colorado, it seemed like a good start even though, I know the Census are not allows accurate. 2.) "PRAIRIE PROGRESS IN WEST CENTRAL SOUTH DAKOTA" (pg. 495) states the following: "Dan married Fannie Charging Eagle, an Agallala Sioux. Her family had lived at Pine Ridge for ten years before her marriage to Dan in 1878 and prior to that in Colorado." [Note]: Notice the spelling of Agallala. I am not sure if, this is a "type O" or, it has meaning that I am unaware of ? 3.) Cheyenne research, Source - "Access Genealogy" website/part of a larger collection called "Indian Tribes of North American", states some of the following: a.) " A little later they seem to have moved to the neighborhood of Lake Traverse and still later part of them occupied a stockade town on the Sheyenne River of North Dakota near the present Lisbon, N. Dak." b.)"When Bent's Fort was built on the upper Arkansas in 1832 a large part decided to establish themselves near it but the rest continued to rove about the headwaters of the North Platte and the Yellowstone. This separation in the tribe was made permanent by the Treaty of Fort Laramie in 1851, the two sections being known respectively as Southern Cheyenne and Northern Cheyenne. In the meantime they had met and formed an alliance with the Arapaho, though there is no memory of the date or the circumstances." Of course, knowing that 1864 was the birth year of Pecokanwin and the same year of the "Sand Creek Massacre", I have to ask myself was Charging Eagle and family survivors of the massacre or, were they not there ? Thanks, kakarns Something of interest concerning the above mentioned. I have been doing some reading in a book titled; "The Peace Chiefs of the Cheyennes" by Stan Hoig. In this book Mr. Hoig has supplied me with some evidence, to support some of my theory's mentioned above, in the quote. Some of the Cheyenne were indeed in Colorado during the time frame that I had been questioning. Which, helps support my reasoning that there was a good chance my relatives were camped there with these Cheyenne's. (Up to 1864). In the book, it mentions: "Chief Yellow Wolf was shot down on a cold November morning in 1864 at Sand Creek only a short way from where he met the Bent's some forty years earlier and invited them to build their fort in Cheyenne country." Therefore, Chief Yellow Wolf was already in Colorado circa 1824. Refer.: "The Peace Chiefs of the Cheyennes" by Stan Hoig *myself kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Oct 14, 2017 3:37:36 GMT -5
YELLOW WOLF -
I recognized the name "Yellow Wolf". I was almost certain that I had seen that name listed with, Charging Eagle (my G.G.G. Grandfather) in some Census that I have. I went back and checked tonight. So far, I have found two Census in which, they are listed together.
One Census states that they were both with Little Wound and the Cut Off's in 1877.
The other Census from 1886, has him listed under #17 "Left Hand". Listed along with Yellow Wolf are; Fly Above, Yellow Bull, White Dress and Sam Last Horse. Directly below Left Hand's group is #18 One Feather's group. Charging Eagle, Bear Wolf, Spotted Elk, Standing Cloud are listed with One Feather.
I am uncertain at this time which, Yellow Wolf seemed to have, some type of relationship with my ancestor, Charging Eagle.
kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Oct 14, 2017 5:52:59 GMT -5
I feel the need to try to write some sort of, small... "Summary To Date/Theory". For many years now, I've been trying to solve the mystery of, where my American Indian Ancestor's "Place of Origin" may have been. Where did we come from, back 6 Generations ago (200+yrs.) TIME FRAME OF THEORY - 1830'S to 1868 ; 1.) I have felt for time now that at least, Charging Eagle's Mother - "Starts Fire" and her family may have originated in the Minnesota or North Dakota, U.S.A. area. a.) Please, read #3.) below which, is from one of my post above. Dated; Oct. 8, 2017. 3.) Cheyenne research, Source - "Access Genealogy" website/part of a larger collection called "Indian Tribes of North American", states some of the following: a.) " A little later they seem to have moved to the neighborhood of Lake Traverse and still later part of them occupied a stockade town on the Sheyenne River of North Dakota near the present Lisbon, N. Dak." b.)"When Bent's Fort was built on the upper Arkansas in 1832 a large part decided to establish themselves near it but the rest continued to rove about the headwaters of the North Platte and the Yellowstone. This separation in the tribe was made permanent by the Treaty of Fort Laramie in 1851, the two sections being known respectively as Southern Cheyenne and Northern Cheyenne. In the meantime they had met and formed an alliance with the Arapaho, though there is no memory of the date or the circumstances." Read more: amertribes.proboards.com/thread/1411/charging-eagle-lakota?page=8#ixzz4vTK2XWYw1.b.) Charging Eagle and parents possibly arrived and settled in the state of Colorado, U.S.A. circa 1832. [NOTE]:Charging Eagle b. 1832 stated on the 1910 Census that he and his Mother were born in North Dakota but, his Father - "Grows Quick" was born in Colorado, U.S.A.. 1.c.) Charging Eagle had daughter, (my G.G. Grandmother), "Top Of The Head" b. March, 1864. Birth location; Rocky Ford, Colorado, U.S.A.. [NOTE]: Rocky Ford, Colorado was only approximately...40 miles N.W. of, "Bent's" Fort/Trading post. 2.a.) While Charging Eagle lived in Colorado, he may have been camped with the Cheyenne's. Including, Chief Yellow Wolf. 2.b.) Sometime during the time frame of the 1864 "Sand Creek Massacre" is when, I think Charging Eagle and family may have joined the camp of, "Chief Little Wound". 2.c.) Next, Charging Eagle and family settled at Medicine Root Creek near Kyle, South Dakota in circa 1868. Laters, kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Oct 22, 2017 3:32:24 GMT -5
QUESTION: Please, refer to the two quoted sentences below: "Chips lives on No Flesh Creek; the next creek west is Little Wound Creek The next west of this is American Horse Creek. No Flesh and Little Wound unite about one mile north of Kyle, and from the point of junction the stream is called Medicine Root." Would anyone have any knowledge as to, what time frame this may have been REFER: Chips Interview with Eli R. Thank you, kakarns
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Post by kingsleybray on Oct 22, 2017 7:22:57 GMT -5
kim, the Ricker-Chips interview was conducted on Thursday, February 14, 1907.
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Post by kakarns on Oct 29, 2017 6:51:59 GMT -5
Thank you Kingsley
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Post by kakarns on Dec 2, 2017 4:20:36 GMT -5
Hello American Tribes and fellow members. I have been very busy with other things in my life including, working allot of hrs.. I still visit the A.T.'s site to do a little reading. Also, read from books and once in a while, jot down a few notes.
Personal Short Story: A few days back, I was fortunate enough to have the time to make a small journey across N.W. Iowa. At my destination, I met up with a Hunka Brother. My Brother helped me to insure some supply donations would reach their new homes. The donations, I mentioned were originally intended for, (fellow website member), LaDonna and the other Water Protectors. However, during my journey last year to N.D., U.S.A , I had some bad luck with my vehicle and wasn't able to continue my journey north.
Sincerely, kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Dec 18, 2017 0:53:05 GMT -5
I feel the need to try to write some sort of, small... "Summary To Date/Theory". For many years now, I've been trying to solve the mystery of, where my American Indian Ancestor's "Place of Origin" may have been. Where did we come from, back 6 Generations ago (200+yrs.) TIME FRAME OF THEORY - 1830'S to 1868 ; 1.) I have felt for time now that at least, Charging Eagle's Mother - "Starts Fire" and her family may have originated in the Minnesota or North Dakota, U.S.A. area. a.) Please, read #3.) below which, is from one of my post above. Dated; Oct. 8, 2017. 3.) Cheyenne research, Source - "Access Genealogy" website/part of a larger collection called "Indian Tribes of North American", states some of the following: a.) " A little later they seem to have moved to the neighborhood of Lake Traverse and still later part of them occupied a stockade town on the Sheyenne River of North Dakota near the present Lisbon, N. Dak." b.)"When Bent's Fort was built on the upper Arkansas in 1832 a large part decided to establish themselves near it but the rest continued to rove about the headwaters of the North Platte and the Yellowstone. This separation in the tribe was made permanent by the Treaty of Fort Laramie in 1851, the two sections being known respectively as Southern Cheyenne and Northern Cheyenne. In the meantime they had met and formed an alliance with the Arapaho, though there is no memory of the date or the circumstances." Read more: amertribes.proboards.com/thread/1411/charging-eagle-lakota?page=8#ixzz4vTK2XWYw1.b.) Charging Eagle and parents possibly arrived and settled in the state of Colorado, U.S.A. circa 1832. [NOTE]:Charging Eagle b. 1832 stated on the 1910 Census that he and his Mother were born in North Dakota but, his Father - "Grows Quick" was born in Colorado, U.S.A.. 1.c.) Charging Eagle had daughter, (my G.G. Grandmother), "Top Of The Head" b. March, 1864. Birth location; Rocky Ford, Colorado, U.S.A.. [NOTE]: Rocky Ford, Colorado was only approximately...40 miles N.W. of, "Bent's" Fort/Trading post. 2.a.) While Charging Eagle lived in Colorado, he may have been camped with the Cheyenne's. Including, Chief Yellow Wolf. 2.b.) Sometime during the time frame of the 1864 "Sand Creek Massacre" is when, I think Charging Eagle and family may have joined the camp of, "Chief Little Wound". 2.c.) Next, Charging Eagle and family settled at Medicine Root Creek near Kyle, South Dakota in circa 1868. Laters, kakarns I found some old NOTES dated; 9-27-2013 and wrote another brief summary to help with time frames etc.. Some info. may seem redundant. Brief Summary of Notes herein; compiled by; Kim A. Karns On; 12-17-17 a.) Fort Laramie Treaty of 1851 b.) 1858 - Gold and silver discovered in Arapaho and Cheyenne Territory c.) 1860 - Another Treaty was signed, changing the location of the Southern Cheyenne reservation. Although, provisions were promised by the Government, it was not enough to provide for the total population. This caused much anger. Soon, war broke out and a reported 400 - 500 Cheyenne were killed. Then next were the orders that they had to move again. They were ordered to move to Oklahoma. d.) 1861 - Approx. 100,00 whites had arrived in the Arapaho and Cheyenne Territory. Within a couple of years time, the Arapaho and Cheyenne were outnumbered and forced out. This has been said to have been some of the changes which, may have played a part in the 1864 - Sand Creek Massacre. e.) 1864 - G.G. Grandmother, (daughter of; Charging Eagle and Transparent Stone) - Pekokawin - b. 3.17.1864 - Rocky Ford, Colorado. e.) 1.) Sand Creek Massacre f.) 1868 - Another massacre broke out, killing hundreds more, Native Americans. f.) 1.) Approx. arrival of Charging Eagle and family at Pine Ridge. kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Jan 13, 2018 10:48:03 GMT -5
Atten: Kingsley: "I'm not sure if this is the proper place to discuss this but, I would like to say something. I met LaDeane Miller on this Board. He helped me for several yrs. on my lineage. Before he retired, he told me he wanted to share some of his files with me. He said something like; "there isn't anyone else he thought might be more deserving and he wanted me to have them." I got pretty choked up on the phone. LaDeane did allot of research for many years and even taught classes on how to do lineage. Now mind you, LaDeane only shared probably a small portion of his files with me. LaDeane was approx. 79 yrs. old when he retired. We have not spoken for along time but, it is with honor I can share some of the work he did. I am very thankful for his trust in me." Read more: amertribes.proboards.com/search/results?captcha_id=captcha_search&where_board_subboard=70%2C51%2C16%2C29%2C43%2C71%2C13%2C60&what_all=Yellow+Wolf&when_days=7000&who_only_made_by=0&display_as=0&search=Search#ixzz544q2olYhUnfortunately, learnt a hard lesson concerning this. I accidently "clicked" on something in info. on my flash drive. When getting to close the documents on the flash drive that LaDenne Miller had sent me, I noticed the computer asked me if, I wanted to save changes I had made. I thought to myself...I didn't make any changes. I clicked the "No" tab. Funny thing was I knew right away I just made at least 2 major mistakes. No back-up file and erased everything on a 16gb flash drive. Sad Sad Sad momment. kakarns
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Post by Dietmar on Jan 14, 2018 6:30:29 GMT -5
kakarns has sent me this photo of Her Good Road, possibly aka Lucy Feather, taken by Frank Rinehart in 1899:
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Post by kakarns on Jan 21, 2018 8:12:02 GMT -5
Dietmar - Thank you Dietmar for posting the photo for me on Jan. 14, 2018 of, "Her Good Road" (aka) Lucy Feather. [NOTE]; It has been stated that this may be one of the daughters of, my relatives/ancestor's - Frank Feather and wife, Close.
UPDATE - dated: 1/21/18 I have been trying to do more advanced research again concerning one of the wive's of, "Charging Eagle". ONE reason for this research is to, (a) try and possibly prove whether or, not some of my ancestor's were related to Chief Red Cloud.
I am referring to Charging Eagle's wife "Breaks Rock" (aka,) "Brave Rock". Charging Eagle married Breaks Rock in 1897.
Atten: Dietmar - In discovering one of your older Threads tonight, titled; "1851 Horse Creek Treaty names" (Fort Laramie). Dated: July 6, 2010 Included in the Cheyenne signatures of the Horse Creek Treaty, one of the Cheyenne's name was; "White Cow" and in Dietmar's translation list of names, you see: "Voist-ti-toe-vetz, White Cow"
Here's some of my old notes dated; 10/16/14.:
1.) White Cow Chief I b. 1827 married: Crow (aka,) Crow Woman [NOTE]: a.) Crow may have been a older sister to Breaks Rock. b.) White Cow Chief and Breaks Rock had son, White Cow Chief II.
2.) Breaks Rock (aka,) Brave Rock b. 1836 d. March 12, 1924- Is listed as the Mother of, White Cow Chief II b. 1852 (per Mike S. site) 2.)a.) [NOTE]: Breaks Rock was the daughter of; "Kills The Bear" and "Old She Bear".
3.) White Cow Chief II b. 1852 married: Mary Eagle b. 1853 (Mary Eagle was the daughter of; Prairie Hen, (aka) Prairie Chicken, (aka) Siyo b. 1832) 4.) White Cow Chief and Mary Eagle had the following children; Wants Him (possibly - ~aka~, Keeps The Mule)b. 1881 d. Oct.1910 [NOTE]: a.)Keeps The Mule b. 1881 is listed with Grandparents - White Cow Chief I and wife, Crow. b.) Wants Him married; Edward Woman Dress son of, Woman's Dress. Alice White Cow Chief - b. 1882
[ADDITIONAL NOTES]: 1.) A 1892 Census lists: Crown Head (aka) Crow On Head (aka) Brown Bull (aka) Yellow Bull I - with his 2 wives,: (sisters) Turns Over and Brave Rock/Breaks Rock 2.) A 1898 Census lists: Turn Over age, 73 - as head of household and has her sister, Breaks Rock age, 62 b. 1836 living with her.
Therefore, a few new questions pop up. a.) Was....Turns Over - ALSO, (aka) Crow (aka) Crow Woman b.) Would the only possible relationship to Chief Red Cloud be through, the Woman's Dress lineage marrying into the White Cow Chief II and Mary Eagle family.
Thanks, kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Feb 18, 2018 2:14:25 GMT -5
Back in about the year 2000, I found a Calico Winter Count Group, Migration 1825-77. Recently, I have tried to piece together two others maps along with the Winter Count. Therefore, trying to focus and study the time frame of; 1825 to 1877. Hopefully, it will help me understand more about the life of, my G.G.G. Charging Eagle. For example; such things as, the different areas he may have migrated to before finally, settling near Kyle, SD in approx., 1868. Also, the desire to learn about, some different circumstances Charging Eagle may have been faced with, during his (and his families), lifetime.
kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Mar 17, 2018 5:30:12 GMT -5
In Refer. to the research request concerning Black Bird.: I am questioning the records I have on Black Bird and wife, Iron Comes Out. 1.) The document (Form 5--153), I have for Charging Eagle's marriage to Paints Herself Brown (Yellow), shows a birth date of 1842 for her. 2.) A document I have, states her parents were; Father = Black Bird and Mother = Iron Comes Out. [Read more: amertribes.proboards.com/thread/1823/oglala-band-structure?page=11#ixzz5A03rvlYP]3.) The records that I have concerning an Oglala - Black Bird and wife, Iron Comes Out is something like this; Comes Out2 (---) (Angelina1 (---)), born 1874 in Oglala Sioux Nation South Dakota. She married Frank Black Bird, born 1872 in Oglala Sioux Nation; died 14 Jun 1926 in Pine Ridge, Shannon, South Dakota, son of Face (---) and Red Bird (---). 4.) Note the ages of Black Bird and his wife, compared to the age listed for Paints Herself Brown (Yellow). HELP ! kakarns
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Post by kakarns on Apr 7, 2018 4:46:26 GMT -5
Re: Kicking Bear and Short Bull « Reply #18 on Apr 3, 2011, 3:03pm » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A website visitor has send me this information on Kicking Bear and his cousin Elbert Chief: Kicking Bear is one of 3 brothers by his father Black Fox and mother Iron Cedar Woman. Kicking Bear, Flying Hawk and Black Fox II. Kicking Bear had one daughter and 3 sons. The one son that lived on into the 1900's is Thunderbird or Frank Kicking Bear. My friend Dave Yakima Chief, Oglala Lakota, now deceased, told me in 1998 that his father, Elbert Chief was first cousins with Frank Kicking Bear. Elbert's father was Thunderbird and his mother was Goes Out With It or Rising Sun. They all (Kicking Bear, Chief and Black Elk too) lived in Manderson, The Wounded Knee District. The Thunderbird name is familial lineage I see. Dave Chief's Lakota Oglala name was Wakinyan also or Thunder. maybe Thunderbird. Dave Chief's mother was Hattie Fills the Pipe whose father was Silas Fills the Pipe and his father was Red Dog. I want to confirm the first cousin relatinship between Elbert Chief and Frank Kicking Bear. Thank you, Tanya Thank you Tanya for sharing this! Read more: amertribes.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=miniconjou1&action=display&thread=263&page=2#ixzz2OGJJHIsDA few months ago, I did a search on American Tribes for Dave Yakima Chief. I was totally amazed that the post above popped up. Since then, I have been making progress on more of the Charging Eagle lineage. A special thank you goes out to Dietmar and LaDeane !! Of course, there are still many unanswered questions. Once again, I'm reaching out for help. 1.) Does anyone have any information on the man named; "Shoots For Them" ? 2.) I am trying to figure out, who the biological parents were of; "Elbert Chief" ? Here are some of my notes. (All of the children are not listed, to simplify the post at this time): A.) Shoots For Them b. 1820-22 married two sisters named "White" b. 1825-27 and "Iron Track" b. 1831-33. B.) Shoots For Them and White had son; "Thunderbird" b. 1854-56. C.) Thunderbird married "Rising Sun" b. 1867-68. D.) Thunderbird and Rising Sun had son; Elbert Chief b. April, 1891-92 E.) Elbert Chief married "Hattie Fills The Pipe" b. 1894 F.) Elbert Chief and Hattie Fills The Pipe had son; Dave Chief (aka), Dave Yakima Chief b. June 25, 1930 d. June 10, 2005. a.) Shoots For Them and Iron Track (aka), Woodpecker had daughter; "Woodpecker" b. 1852-53 b.) Woodpecker married "Chief Kicking Bear" b. 1846 c.) Woodpecker and Kicking Bear had son; "Frank Kicking Bear" b.1887-89 d.) Frank Kicking Bear married "Mabel Brown Ears" b. 1895 and "Nancy Sitting Bull" b. 1903 d. 1959 [Notes]: 1.) Rising Sun was the daughter of; "Whistler" b. 1832 and "Little Old Woman" b. 1828-32 2.) A Rising Sun also married a man named; "Willaim (William sp. ?) Clifford"(aka), Willaim Pinueau or, Peno. Rising Sun and Willaim Clifford had a son named; "Chief Peno" b.1892. Was this actually, Elbert Chief ? Ran out of time this a.m. Hopefully, someone can help with this. Thank You ! kakarns Refer's: LaDeane Miller Tanya Malase Dietmar American Tribes Website Mike Stevens Website I decided tonight, to share more about relative , Dave Yakama Chief (aka), Wakinyan.; a.) I was recently reviewing some of my research notes etc., when, I re-discovered a copy of, the Obituary for the late D. Y. Chief. b.) The obit also states that D. Y. Chief served as, a Spiritual Advisor for Leonard Peltier for many years. c.) Including along with the obit is a copy of, a thank you letter to; D.Y. Chief from; Leonord Peltier. In Loving Memory Of - Dave Yakama Chief kakarns
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