Big Ribs, Oglala

[Dietmar]

What do we know about Big Ribs (or Big Rib), an important Oglala leader in the 1860s and 70s?

First, there are two portraits of Big Ribs I´ve been wondering about for some time. You find several versions of them in the internet, for example in the archives of the Huntington Library.

As far as I know, these pictures were taken by Denver/Colorado based photographer W. G. Chamberlain. Do they indeed show the Oglala Big Ribs?

Colorado Historian Evadene Swanson has done some research on the portraits, but I can´t find the article online. Does anyone know where to find it?:
"Swanson, Evadene, Big Rib Role Remains a Mystery, 02/11/1976, The Triangle Review
Story of discovery of photograph of Big Rib, an Ogala Sioux chief, second in rank to Red Cloud in the 1860-70s.
Photograph by William Gunnison Chamberlain of Denver, active in area from 1861-1881. Connection to local history unclear."
history.fcgov.com/archive/ethnic/native6.php

"An article in the Triangles Review (now the Fort Collins Review) discussing what is known about Big Rib, who was said at times to be Oglala and at other times to be half Cheyenne. He is mentioned in several historical accounts as being with Red Cloud's band."
warehouse.olc.edu/local_links/archives/jsc1.htm

One might wonder why a photographer in Denver has photographed an Oglala Lakota chief, but when reading some Colorado history articles I found that Big Rib and his band indeed moved at least in the spring of 1865 into the vicinity of Fort Collins. These photos were probably taken around 1869:


from left to right: Moses Anker, Big Rib, Tom Clayton


Big Rib


Any thoughts on this?

[kingsleybray]

Big Ribs is said by one of my Oglala friends to have been a chief of the Spleen (Tapisleca) band. He reportedly found a number of dutch oven kettles near Ft Laramie, about the early 1850s, and from this incident his particular tiyospaye was called Kettle-with-Legs, Cehuhaton. This small group settled a few miles north of Pine Ridge Agency in the 1880s, the locality where Holy Rosary Mission was built, and which is today's Calico community. His children, some possibly in the expansive Lakota sense, included Black Shawl (Crazy Horse's wife, born c. 1843-44), Red Feather (born c. 1852-53), and White Calf (born c. 1856-57).

He was indeed living in the Ft Collins locality in 1865, where he was recruited to serve as a messenger to the Oglala bands in the north to attend treaty talks at Ft Laramie. Perhaps he remained in Colorado after the reservation was established, since he seems hard to trace in the agency records. He appears in the Spleen or "Melt Band" in the Red Cloud Agency register in early 1877, his family of 15 including White Calf and two other adult males (Elk and Boy). He is listed close to Yellow Bear, who my informant states was "cousins" to Big Ribs. He is listed again under the "Melt" band in the 1879 Pine Ridge Ration Roll. He then appears in the Pine Ridge 1890 census under the Melt band, where his age is given as 73 -- born in c. 1816-17. I don't know when he died. He still feels a bit elusive to me.

Pete Catches, the great Oglala holy man in the last century, was a descendant of Big Ribs.

[Dietmar]

Thanks Kingsley.

Another picture from the same session by Chamberlain:


Big Rib


We have some details on Big Ribs in the book "Circle of Fire: The Indian War of 1865" by John Dishon McDermott, page 146 ff:

"To deal with these nontreaty Sioux, General Dodge used Indian emissaries to carry the word that the government wanted to meet with them. Principal among them was Big Ribs, who arrived at Fort Laramie on October 17.¹⁰ His mission was to tell the Lakota that the Great White Father took pity on them and did not wish to fight them. Rather, he wished to make peace and give them presents as he did before the war. They were to know that the Great Father had whipped his enemies, the bad white men in the states, and if the Sioux and Cheyennes did not make peace, he would send thousand of soldiers during the winter and next spring to destroy them.¹¹

Big Ribs was instructed to carry the message to certain chiefs and headmen. The list given to him identifies the leaders of many of the bands that had been fighting the army in Nebraska, Wyoming, and Montana in 1865. Big Ribs was to speak the following:

Oglala: Man Afraid [of His Horses], Back Wound [Bad Wound] or Mischief maker, Hair Plait, Corn Band, Swift Bear, Big Partisan, Bear That Looks Back, and Tall Indian.
Brules: Spotted Tail, Red Leaf, Standing Elk, and Song Face.
Bad faces: Black Bear, Red Cloud, Long Soldier, The Man That Steals the White Man´s Horse, Sitting Bear, and Trunk.
O Yoki ha pas: Standing Bear, Single Crow, Red, and Black Foxes (Bissonette´s brother-in-law).
Minniconjous: Roman Nose, Low Horse, Little Bull, and White Bull.
Cheyennes: Gray Head, Bull Bear, Dull Knife, Tall Bull, Flake Foot, Double Head, White Clay, Spotted Elk, Man That Stands in the Water, Little Wolf, Big Head, Old Bear, Little Bear Wolf, Spotted Wolf, and White Man.¹²

After receiving his instructions, Big Ribs left the post on October 19 and headed for the Lakota camps. According to one observer, he was gorgeously arrayed in fine clothes and brass buttons.¹³

Footnotes:
¹⁰ Young, “Journals of Will H. Young, 1865,” 382. Big Ribs had been arrested in April, sent to Fort Laramie under guard in May, and returned to his band later in summer, where he camped near Denver, living on government rations, until summoned by the military in October. See letter from Lt. Ewell Drake, Headquarters, Fort Collins, C.T., April 29, 1865, to Acting Assistant Adjutant General, District of the Plains, Letters from Col C. H. Porter, headquarters, South Sub District of the plains, Denver, July 17 and July 18, 1865, to Capt. George Price, Acting assistant Adjutant General, Fort Laramie, letters Received, District of Colorado, Entry 3258, Part II, Records of U.S. Army Commands, RG 393; Josephine Clements, “Big Rib Fate,” (Fort Collins, Colorado) Triangle review, June 29, 1987.

¹¹ Letters from General Upton, Commanding District of Colorado, Denver, October 3, 1865, to General Wheaton, letters received, District of Nebraska, Entry 3198, and Letter of Instructions from Brevet Major Commanding District of Nebraska, Fort Laramie, October 18, 1865, to Big Ribs, letters sent, District of Nebraska, Entry 3187, Part II, RG 393.

¹² Memorandum of the Chiefs and Head-Men Whom Big Ribs Is to Visit, October 18, 1865, letters Sent, District of Nebraska, R G 393.

¹³ Young, “Journals of Will H. Young, 1865,” 382"


Very interesting list of chiefs, don´t you think?


In a Colorado newspaper reprint we find a short mention of Big Ribs regarding his Cheyenne relation:

On May 1 [1865] a detail was sent to Fort Laramie , I . T ., in “charge of a half breed Chayan named Big Ribs, whom they will closely guard.”
(The Fort Collins Express – Anniversary Number, May 20, 1923, Page 3)

[kingsleybray]

The list of chiefs Big Ribs was told to visit and invite to peace talks is a very interesting document. I have not seen the original, nor a microfilm version, so what follows must be tentative - but I think there are some clear mis-transcriptions, mis-hearings, or mis-prints of the names as listed. This is my proposed 'corrected' list:

Memorandum of the Chiefs and Head-Men Whom Big Ribs Is to Visit, October 18, 1865
(Source: Letters Sent, District of Nebraska; National Archives, Record Group 393)


Brules: Spotted Tail, Red Leaf, Standing Elk, and Long Face.

Corn Band [also Brules]: Swift Bear, Big Partisan, Bear That Looks Back, and Tall Mandan.

Oglala: Man Afraid of His Horse, Bad Wound (nickname: Mischief-Maker), Hair Plait.

Bad Faces [also Oglalas]: Brave Bear, Red Cloud, Long Soldier, The Man That Steals the White Man´s Horse [i.e. American Horse], Sitting Bear, and Trunk.

O.yoke.hupas [Oyuhpe band of Oglala]: Standing Bear, Single Horn, Red Dog, Black Fox and Bad Hand (Joseph Bissonette´s brother-in-law).

Miniconjous: Roman Nose, Lone Horn, Little Bull, and White Bull [i.e. White Hollow Horn].

Cheyennes: Gray Head, Bull Bear, Dull Knife, Tall Bull, Flake Foot, Double Head, White Clay, Spotted Elk, Man That Stands in the Water, Little Wolf, Big Head, Old Bear, Little Bear, Bear Wolf, Spotted Wolf, and Tall White Man.

(Some names amended from original by KMB. Additional Note 11/09/2017: I have amended the names to the original readings given in Ephriam's verbatim transcript of the original document. See next posting below. )

[ephriam]

While at the National Archives today, I looked up the original document with the names. Here is a better transcription of the names:

Memorandum of the chiefs and head men whom “Big Ribs” is to visit and invite to come in to Fort Laramie.

------------------Sioux------------------------------
Man afraid of his horses ----------- Oh.ga.la.lah
Bad Wound or Mischief Maker
Hair Plait
Swift Bear -----------------------------Corn Band
Big Partizan
Bear that looks back
Tall Indian.
Spotted Tail -----------------------------Brules
Red Leaf
Standing Elk
Long Face
Brave Bear -------------------------------Bad Faces
Red Cloud
Long Soldier
The man that Steals the white man’s horses
Sitting Bear
Trunk
Standing Bear ---------------------------O.yoke.hupas
Single Horn
Red Dog
Black Fox
Bad Hand (Bissonet’s brother-in-law)
Roman Nose-----------------------------Minneconcanges
Lone Horn
Little Bull
White Bull
----------------------Cheyennes-----------------------
Grey Head
Bull Bear
Dull Knife
Tall Bull
Flake Foot
Double Head
White Clay
Spotted Elk
Man that Stands in the water
Little Wolf
Big Head
Old Bear
Little Bear
Bear Wolf
Spotted Wolf
Tall White Man

District of Nebraska, Letters Sent
(RG393 Part II, Entry 3187, p. 46-47)

[grigoryev]

In the book "Crazy Horse: A Lakota Life" there is a mention of the following Person - Black Shawl's other brother Iron Horse. Is this true? What is known additionally to this person?

[frenchman]

Greetings from France ,

very interesting thread about Big Ribs especially the list of chiefs and headmen which must be met by his délégation but in that list I have found several names which are unusual to see (at least for me ).

-Hair Plait for the oglala tribe

-Long Face for the Brulés

-Bear That Look Back for the Brulé's Corn Band

-Single Horn ,Bad Hand and Black Fox for the Oyuhpes (is this Black Fox the same as the chief of the Cancahuhan? I doubt  because that group had left the Bad Faces for the Oyuhpes around 1876 ).

-Little Bull of the Miniconjous (cited as the chief of the Wak-To-Ni-La by Hayden in 1857 / 58 ) 

So, does anyone have any informations about these men (sub-band of belonging ,summarized genealogy and history )?

Thank you very much for all details you could provide !

[frenchman]

Good evening  everybody ,
in my last post above I had made a big mistake , of course the chie!f of the Cancahuhan sub-band was not Black Fox but Black Rock !
I had already found on American Tribes all I wanted to learn about the Oyuhpe Black Fox (Wakan Band I think )!
But , for the other men I am always searching some details about them ;
Thank you for all informations you could provide !

[grahamew]

This is Ribs, said to be a Lakota/Cheyenne hunter associated with Thomas Twiss, 1859. Is this the same man ten years or so years later? The Cheyenne connection might explain why he was in Colorado. Shot in the dark, I know...

[Dietmar]

Oh wow, I think you´re right!!

[grahamew]

His relationship with Twiss might go some way to explaining why he was used as a messenger to the Northern bands and I guess it's backed by your quote, "On May 1 [1865] a detail was sent to Fort Laramie , I . T ., in “charge of a half breed Chayan named Big Ribs, whom they will closely guard.”
(The Fort Collins Express – Anniversary Number, May 20, 1923, Page 3). 'Half breed" as in half-Lakota and half-Cheyenne.

[Dietmar]

The ambrotype of Rib is part of a series now in the National Museum of American History:

americanhistory.si.edu/collections/search?edan_q=ambrotype&edan_fq%5B%5D=online_visual_material:true&edan_local=1&edan_fq%5B%5D=culture:%22Indians+of+North+America%22

James D. Hutton took the pictures when he was working for the Raynolds Expedition in 1859. The man we think is Big Ribs was identified by Dr. F. V. Hayden as "Rib, a Cheyenne man married to a Sioux woman":


enhanced picture of Rib by Koos van Oostrom

From Dr. F. V. Hayden’s “Contributions to the Ethnography and Philology of the Indian Tribes of the Missouri Valley”:

"Rib has a Dakota wife, one quarter white." (page 277)

[Rib] "is a Shyenne brave, an excellent hunter, with fine natural powers, quick perceptions and intelligence, increased by long association with the whites." (page 457)

[grahamew]

I'm still not sure, but I'm quoting Kingsley here: "F V Hayden's Contributions to the Ethnography, Philology etc. has some notes on the engraved versions of Hutton's photos. They identify the "Shyenne Brave" as Ribs, a Cheyenne-Lakota hunter for Agent Twiss."
That second man identified by the NMAH as Smutty Bear is surely incorrect; it's Two Bears of the Crow