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Post by ephriam on Sept 2, 2014 5:20:25 GMT -5
From the St. Louis Evening Gazette in the spring of 1844, which suggests Standing Bull is still with the southern Oglala in the winter of 1843-44:
"A letter received by Major Adams [David Adams?], at Independence, states that at various times during the past winter, the Sioux Indians made repeated inroads upon the Pawnees, and each time gained a victory over their ancient enemy. The Sioux were commanded by their chiefs, Iron Shell, Bull Eagle, Eagle Ribs, and Standing Bull. Eighty of the Pawnees were killed, two taken prisoners, and one hundred lodges destroyed. The loss of the Sioux was three killed. All the independent fur companies trading on the north fork of Platte, White river, and Missouri, have done well this summer. Buffalos were plenty on the Platte."
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Post by kingsleybray on Sept 2, 2014 5:33:54 GMT -5
That's terrific, Ephriam. I wonder whether this is the first record of Standing Bull III? I've updated my message-entry on Standing Bull III accordingly!
Also, embedded in here somewhere is the recapture of one of the Cheyenne Sacred Arrows. My friend Neil Gilbert, here in the UK, got a statement at Rosebud a few years ago that Iron Shell was the man who gave the Arrow back to the Cheyenne.
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Post by kingsleybray on Sept 3, 2014 4:26:52 GMT -5
I've updated the entries on Standing Bulls I, II and III.
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Post by ephriam on Sept 6, 2014 9:58:33 GMT -5
Good morning, everyone:
I have been trying to match up the later Standing Bull’s with the census records we have from the 1880s forward. The records suggest that we may have missed something:
1. Standing Rock Agency, 1881-82:
Standing Bull (born ca. 1835) and his wife Shouting (b. c1836) appear among the surrendered Oglala from Canada ennumerated at the Standing Rock Agency in 1881 (Family 525, Dickson, Sitting Bull Surrender Census, p. 139). Notice that the next family listed (#526) is that of Painted Rock (b. c1830) which includes his sister named Short Woman (b. c1821).
Both Standing Bull and Painted Rock appear in the Big Road Roster 1881 in Little Hawk’s band and are listed adjacent to each other in McLaughlin’s annuity list for 1881. They are also both listed among the Oglala transfers to Pine Ridge in 1882.
These records suggest that there is a close relationship between Standing Bull and Painted Rock, that they had come in from Canada, were transferred to Standing Rock in 1881 and finally sent down to Pine Ridge to join the other Oglala in 1882.
2. Pine Ridge Agency census, 1886:
Our next glimpse of these two families is in the census records at Pine Ridge in 1886. Standing Bull’s age is given as 50, matching the previous census. But his wife is now listed as White Cow (b. c1839), probably a different name for the same woman.
Also notice that the 1886 census includes two additions to the Standing Bull family. Pointed Rock (b. c1831) is listed as his stepmother. I suspect that this is a mistake by the census taker and that this is in fact the man named Painted Rock listed in the records above. Also in the family is a woman named Short Woman (b. c1816), only five year age difference from the sister of Painted Rock listed in the Sitting Bull Surrender Census. I believe that both of these individuals are the same as the 1881 census.
Crucial for our discussion, notice that Short Woman is listed in the 1886 census as the mother of Standing Bull, thus a clue to the relationship between these two families.
3. Pine Ridge Agency census, 1887-1890
Something appears to have happened by the time we get to the next set of census records. First, notice that Standing Bull is suddenly ten years older (b. c1827). Also notice that while Short Woman had been listed the previous year as his mother, now she is recorded as his wife. Also notice that the woman Shouts/White Cow who had previously been listed as Standing Bull’s wife is now shown in this family as a daughter-in-law.
What does this mean?
I think the census records show that the Standing Bull we see from 1881-1886 is not the same person as the one we see from 1887 to 1900. The fact that there is an age difference of only ten years (if the age estimates can be trusted), suggests that this is not a father-son relationship. What makes the most sense is that these two individuals are brothers. With the death of one brother, the other has taken on the family name, a very common tradition among the Lakota.
Identifying this brother is a bit of a challenge. The only clue we have is his approximate age and that his wife in 1887-90 was named Short Woman.
One possibility is that this brother is yet to be identified among the other family names. I will keep looking.
Another possibility is that the brother we are looking for is in fact Painted Rock. Notice that our last mention of Painted Rock is in 1886, assuming that I am correct about the census error. This correlates to the first appearance of the new Standing Bull in 1887. While the ages are approximately correct, that would also mean that the 1881 census taker made a mistake in referring to Short Woman as a sister when in fact she was his wife.
I suggest that Standing Bull IV (b. c1835-36) actually died about 1886 and that his brother took the name and survived until about 1900 or 1901. Further work needs to be done to identify who this brother is, but so far, I am leaning towards Painted Rock. Perhaps Howard White Face has some additional family traditions. It would be interesting to inquire if there is any memory of an individual named Painted Rock.
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Post by kingsleybray on Sept 6, 2014 10:24:56 GMT -5
fantastic details, thanks Ephriam. I shall try to follow up with Howard.
American Horse, presenting his winter count to Dr Corbusier in 1879 recounted how the first entry (1775-76) represented the 'discovery' of the Black Hills by Standing Bull, "the great-grandfather of the present Standing-Bull". Hence my assumption of four Standing Bulls across 1775-1900.
The "present Standing Bull" in 1879 remains the man I have identified as Standing Bull IV. What looks possible now is that he died c. 1886 and his elder brother assumed the family name. So there was a Standing Bull V - possibly the man called Painted Rock. I shall continue looking into this.
One thing Howard spoke about was that the family name got changed to White Face about this time in the 1880s-90s. Perhaps the two phenomena are somehow related.
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Post by ephriam on Sept 6, 2014 12:21:35 GMT -5
I may have spoken too soon. I continued following Standing Bull through the census records in an effort to find other relatives and discovered a glitche in my initial theory.
Pine Ridge Census Records, 1892-1900
So while Standing Bull's age was ten years older in the census records from 1887-1890, it dropped back down to the expected age for Standing Bull IV (born c. 1835-36) in the census records for 1892-1900 period. That does not explain all the mix-up in relationships, but I may have "jumped the gun" in proposing that there are in fact two Standing Bull's during this period. Perhaps the normal inaccuracies of the census taking process.
Just to make it more confusing is the relationship of Kills the White Man. Not mentioned in the 1881-1886 records, he is listed living with Standing Bull from 1887 forward. During the 1887-90 period, he is shown as a young man, born c1854. From 1892 to 1900, he is suddenly a much older man, born c1832. And he changes from nephew to uncle of Standing Bull. (except one year when they are both listed as brothers).
Pine Ridge Records, 1900-1901
Finally, I checked the federal census of the Pine Ridge Agency for 1900. That record shows that both Standing Bull and Kills White were living in the home of Paul Flying Horse, located in the Wakpamni District. Both of these older men were listed as uncles of Paul. Standing Bull gave his age as 63 and the census enumerator recorded that he was born in May 1837 in North Dakota, adding that both of his parents were also born in ND.
Finally, I found a list of deaths in 1901 in the Wakpamni District which shows that Standing Bull died on March 31, 1901. This is confirmed by the fact that in the official Pine Ridge Agency census, Kills White is shown alone and there is no mention of Standing Bull.
Conclusion
With the addition of this new census data, I suspect that what we were seeing above is the inherent mistakes that we find in the census records and that Standing Bull IV (born c1835-36) is the same individual who died in 1901. Darn... thought I had found something new!
Still working on the White Face data...
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Post by ephriam on Sept 6, 2014 15:54:32 GMT -5
Here is what I have been able to find about the White Face family so far:
White Face Ite Ska (born ca. 1842-43 in SD -- died 9 April 1910 Porcupine District, SD)
There are several individuals named White Face among the Oglala at Red Cloud/Pine Ridge, so it is easy to get individuals mixed up. In 1878, for example, there are four men named White Face recorded in the census records -- on among the Kiyuksa, one with the Wajaja, one in High Wolf's band and another in Three Bears band. I suspect that none of these are who we are looking for.
A man named White Face surrendered with Crazy Horse at the Red Cloud Agency in May 1877. Could be him. There was also a White Face who served as an Indian Scout at Red Cloud that year (not him).
I could not identify him in the 1881 Sitting Bull Surrender Census.
He first appears in any census records in 1892 at the Pine Ridge Agency. There were a number of traditional families who appear to have escaped being counted in the census records until after the Ghost Dance. White Face appears to have been one of them.
According to the 1900 census, White Face had been married his two wives, Old Lodge and Terrapin Lights, for 30 years, putting their marriage about 1870.
Old Lodge had 10 children, 6 of whom were still living in 1900. I have been able to find the names of only 4 so far: Stephen Swallow (b. 1879 -- d. Oct.2, 1959) William Wife Face, also known as Charging Horse (b. c1883-84 -- d. after 1935) Susie White Face (b. 1890-91) Jessie White Face (b. c1893) -- she attended Carlisle in 1910.
His second wife, Terrapin Lights, had 7 children, only 2 of whom were still living in 1900: Richard Tail (b. c1872 -- d. Apr. 25, 1937) Thomas White Face (b. c1877 -- d. Sept. 1967)
The family settled in the Porcupine District where they received their allotments.
One possible connection is that White Face was the son of Standing Bull III (and a brother of Standing Bull IV).
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Post by hreinn on Sept 18, 2014 18:29:52 GMT -5
From the St. Louis Evening Gazette in the spring of 1844, which suggests Standing Bull is still with the southern Oglala in the winter of 1843-44: "A letter received by Major Adams [David Adams?], at Independence, This Major Adams could have been an older brother of David Adams, based on Alex Charging Crow (son of David Adams) in his Autobiography, page V: "About this time it was rumoured all over that many white people came into our country, and also that additional soldiers arrived and settled at Ft. Laramie. I returned to this place and stayed there. while I was living with my grandparents I overheard that my father's older brother was living and that he was employed at this place. He probably heard about me, so finally he located me and took me over and I lived with him there for two winters."
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Post by hreinn on Sept 18, 2014 20:31:11 GMT -5
Based on a post in the thread Bull Bear and family, on September 19. amertribes.proboards.com/thread/1268/bull-bear-family?page=4It is possible that : 1. Standing Bull 2 was actually a brother or "brother" of "the Older" Little Wound (killed in 1834). Where this "Older" Little Wound was not Bull Bear (d.1841). 2. Standing Bull 2 was killed in a "drunken brawl" in 1834 (not 1841). Which could be related to the incident which Cloud Shield referred to for in the name for the winter 1832-1833. That is, all of Standing Bull's horses were killed, but by whom was unknown.
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Post by kingsleybray on Jan 18, 2015 6:45:59 GMT -5
Over the past few days I have been able to obtain detailed traditions about the history of the True Oglala band, passed down in his old age by Thomas American Horse (c. 1869-1963). The Standing Bull line of chiefs is confirmed as belonging to that band.
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Post by kingsleybray on Jan 20, 2015 12:15:25 GMT -5
Correcting Standing Bull I's family background.
We now have strong data which makes some of the assumptions and hypotheses I presented above null and void!
According to genealogical information I've been privileged to see, Standing Bull and Bull Bear's father (either Stone Knife II or White Swan) were brothers.
Their mother was a daughter of Buffalo Standing Up or Holy Standing Buffalo. Her three brothers were Split Rock (Inyan Naslecha) - the ancestor of the Sitting Bear-American Horse line; Dreams of Pretty Places (Makoche Washte Oihanble); and Buffalo Horn Spoon (Pte He Chiska) - the father of Bull Hoop.
These brothers were the ones who quarrelled and scattered dirt in each other's faces. Split Rock and his supporters now aligned to the Mato Oyate band. This grouping became known as True Oglala.
Dreams of Pretty Places and Buffalo Horn Spoon (seemingly the youngest brother) withdrew, formed their own camp, but retained the old band name Kiyuksa. Their sister, whose name has been rendered illegible in the ledger book due to water damage, was married to Bull Bear's grandfather (Stone Knife I probably), so their family must have sided with Dreams of Pretty Places and Buffalo Horn Spoon. I would imagine that the brothers Standing Bull and Stone Knife, also their cousin Bull Hoop, would have been small children at the time of the Scattering quarrel.
Dreams of Pretty Place's children were Whirlwind Bear, White Rock, and a daughter, her name not recorded.
The Buffalo Horn Spoon-Bull Hoop line moved to the Sichangu (Brule) at some point, founding the Kiyuksa band there. The Ring Bull family at Rosebud today are their descendants.
Standing Bull I grew up in the Kiyuksa band, married a Miniconjou woman, and later moved back to join the True Oglala. His uncle (lekshi, mother's brother) was a headman in that camp and its winter count keeper.
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Post by kingsleybray on Jan 23, 2015 18:30:33 GMT -5
I've just updated the above message with some new data obtained today.
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dado
New Member
Posts: 34
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Post by dado on Jan 24, 2015 1:57:49 GMT -5
Kingsley, it would be extremely interesting to know how the family background of Stone Knife I had been. Do you have any news? In what subband he grew up?
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Post by kingsleybray on Feb 9, 2015 8:43:31 GMT -5
" Over the past few days I have been able to obtain detailed traditions about the history of the True Oglala band, passed down in his old age by Thomas American Horse (c. 1869-1963). The Standing Bull line of chiefs is confirmed as belonging to that band."Read more: amertribes.proboards.com/thread/2132/standing-bull-tatanka-nazhin?page=2#ixzz3RFqqxEeAContinued conversations have shown that the name Standing Bull, Tatanka Nazhin, first appears in the American Horse ledger winter counts in the 1500s (16th c.). So it is a very old name in the Izuza oyate. The same name or variations is found in families in both the Itazipcho Tetons, and the Sisseton. Remember the Sisseton was where the original Izuza people broke away from in c. 1450. My friend affirms that all these families were originally related - "same people". The first Standing Bull to emerge clearly in the ledger record must have been born late in the 17th c. He was the father of Split Rock, Dreams of Pretty Places, Buffalo Horn Spoon and a daughter (name not recorded). The daughter was married into the Kiyuksa band, their sons included the next Standing Bull. According to the LaDeane Miller genealogies, his dates were c. 1738-1811. Another name of prominence for many generations among the Oglalas, and their antecedents, was Sitting Bear, Mato Iyotanke. As many readers will know, it belonged to the American Horse family in the 19th c. It is first recorded in the ledger winter counts in the late 15th c. So maybe Whetstone, the headman who founded the Izuza band in c. 1450+, was succeeded by the first Sitting Bear. It looks as if the names Whetstone, Sitting Bear, and Standing Bull were borne by several succeeding generations of leading men in the Izuza band (ancestral True Oglala), in the early phases of its history, say c. 1450-1650.
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Post by kingsleybray on Feb 12, 2015 9:03:22 GMT -5
So, the man I classified as Standing Bull I was far from the first Standing Bull.
I argued that during his maturity, the later 18th c., he enjoyed a central role in the kinship networks of the Oglala people. I think the new information is bearing that out. I was I admit surprised to learn that his wife (or one of them) was Miniconjou-Hohwozhu rather than Oglala.
But the new fine-grained detail on his immediate family background permits us to see that Standing Bull embodied the fundamental tribal union of the Oglala nation. His father was Kiyuksa, derived from the Mdewakanton Dakota in the late 17th c. His mother was of the Izuza band, who we now know were among the first peoples to form the Teton three centuries earlier, and in Standing Bull's boyhood earned the new name True Oglala.
It's turning out to be an even more extraordinary dynasty than I thought!
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