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Post by naiches on Aug 28, 2009 17:54:45 GMT -5
I visited few places, i saw little and to top it all i'm too nervousI have very rare photo of Chihuahua's band when arrived in Fort Marion april 16 1886. I think tall man in hat in center is Old Nana and to righ of him - Chief Chihuahua. Сan anyone identify the other people?
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Post by jeroen on Aug 29, 2009 3:04:21 GMT -5
Great photograph! Never seen it before... I think you are right in identifying Nana and Chihuahua... I think the warrior standing next to Nana, in white shirt, is Ulzana. Among the women, back row and center, is Tonse, who was related to Naiche. The woman standing right behind Chihuahua is probably his wife. I surely hope you can get a higher resolution of this magnificent picture, so we can id even more Apaches...
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Post by inkpaduta1981 on Sept 3, 2009 13:41:13 GMT -5
The firs woman sitting left, white dressed, is Tay-ayz-slath, one of Geronimo's wives. The identifications of Nana and Chihuahua are right.
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Post by perico on May 6, 2010 10:20:57 GMT -5
Ulzanna is the man 2 people down from the right of Chihuahua. He is sitting down. He has a boy in front of him with a white headband on, and another man sitting beside him. This is a positive identification. There is one other photograph taken at the same time as this one and has identifications on all of the men. In this photograph here are some of the men: Colle, Seelto, Negoltisin, Chihuahua, Eskinya, Dakeya, Lancer, Nana, Nadosr, Shuit, Ulzanna, Stalosh, Todasnege, and Petr. I visited few places, i saw little and to top it all i'm too nervousI have very rare photo of Chihuahua's band when arrived in Fort Marion april 16 1886. I think tall man in hat in center is Old Nana and to righ of him - Chief Chihuahua. Сan anyone identify the other people?
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Post by perico on May 6, 2010 10:21:26 GMT -5
Where did the identification on the women come from? Published anywhere or guessing?
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Post by naiches2 on May 6, 2010 15:28:11 GMT -5
Look on thread 'Chiricahua Apache women'by Jeroen.
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Post by jeroen on May 7, 2010 12:36:52 GMT -5
Could you post the alternative version of the photograph above?
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Post by perico on May 9, 2010 18:20:47 GMT -5
Could you post the alternative version of the photograph above? Possibly, its a rare photograph and I dont want it used for the wrong purposes. If I saw that it was published in a book or an article or available online I would for sure.
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Post by perico on May 9, 2010 18:26:10 GMT -5
Also keep in mind that there was supposed to be 77 people in Chihuahuas band. That means a bunch are missing. So does this mean that the women identifications are published and are for certain, or are speculation.
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Post by jeroen on May 11, 2010 3:32:57 GMT -5
Perico, we all share photographs freely, also rare ones, all with the best intentions. Most members with this forum are seriously interested and try to gather new information, including me. That is why I asked you to post the alternative version of the photograph. But if you are afraid of the picture being used for the "wrong puposes", then don't post it here. Coming to your remark that the photo does not show all 77 people, it is certain that a number of the women and children taken prisoner earlier and held at Fort Bowie did join Chihuahua when he and his band were sent to Florida. So we can be reasonably certain about the id's of the women mentioned above. Also, I noticed one warrior named Eskinya, is this the same as the one who, with his brother Pionsenay, challenged Taza in 1876?
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Post by perico on May 11, 2010 10:07:58 GMT -5
Jeroen, >Perico, we all share photographs freely, also rare ones, all with the best intentions. I didnt question that. People seem to be friendly. There are other websites out there to claim to be so called bands of Chiricahua/Warm Springs Apache Tribes that are not federally recognized. I found out that the picture you want me to post is public domain. >Coming to your remark that the photo does not show all 77 >people, it is certain that a number of the women and children >taken prisoner earlier and held at Fort Bowie did join Chihuahua >when he and his band were sent to Florida. So we can be >reasonably certain about the id's of the women mentioned >above. Yes I am familiar with my own peoples history. I was just pointing out to those that didnt know, that not everyone there at the time was photographed. >Also, I noticed one warrior named Eskinya, is this the same as >the one who, with his brother Pionsenay, challenged Taza in >1876? If I recall correctly, Eskinya was killed by Naiche and his brother was wounded. This person has the same name but isnt the same person. Perico, we all share photographs freely, also rare ones, all with the best intentions. Most members with this forum are seriously interested and try to gather new information, including me. That is why I asked you to post the alternative version of the photograph. But if you are afraid of the picture being used for the "wrong puposes", then don't post it here. Coming to your remark that the photo does not show all 77 people, it is certain that a number of the women and children taken prisoner earlier and held at Fort Bowie did join Chihuahua when he and his band were sent to Florida. So we can be reasonably certain about the id's of the women mentioned above. Also, I noticed one warrior named Eskinya, is this the same as the one who, with his brother Pionsenay, challenged Taza in 1876? Attachments:
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Post by naiches2 on May 11, 2010 10:53:07 GMT -5
Thank you very much Perico! Now we finally know all the 'Cossaks of the Sierra Madre' by name. Except for one man. Who is this man:
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Post by shan on May 11, 2010 11:38:14 GMT -5
naiches2,
congratulations, great detective work going on here, and good quality blow ups from a small orginal. Would it be possible to blow up the section that has Jolsanny or Ulzanna in it? From what people have been writing here over the last from weeks it seems the man I had always taken to be Ulzana was somebody else.
Low Dog
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Post by naiches2 on May 11, 2010 11:53:55 GMT -5
Sorry, I get this shot from flash-movie from internet and panorama ended at this moment
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Post by perico on May 11, 2010 12:32:16 GMT -5
naiches2, congratulations, great detective work going on here, and good quality blow ups from a small orginal. Would it be possible to blow up the section that has Jolsanny or Ulzanna in it? From what people have been writing here over the last from weeks it seems the man I had always taken to be Ulzana was somebody else. Low Dog Attachments:
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