In 1934 an Indian named Coffee said Crazy Horse snr, ie Worm, had one son, named Crazy Horse, and one daughter, named Looks At Her and that this daughter was his, Coffee's, mother, and that she had no other children.
Did Coffee say something more ? Is it known when Coffee was born ? Is the name of Coffee's father known ? (perhaps Club Man ?) Are more relatives and/or descendants of Coffee known ? Where can this interview with Coffee be seen ?
Loutre; you are perhaps referring to the description of Crazy Horse's hair and skin, which was lighter in complexion than most other Lakotas.
There is no direct information available regarding Crazy Horse being a mixed blood. According to the Clown family on one of their DVDs, Crazy Horse's mother hair and skin was also light in complexion compared to most other Lakotas. So this light complexion goes back at least two generations.
The lighter complexion of Crazy Horse and his mother is not necessarily due to blood mixing. The colour of both hair and skin in humans depends on Melanin proteins. Various skin and hair colours are due to different amount and/or different types of Melanin (i.e. Eu-melanin and Pheo-melanin) Melanin production depends on an expression of a number of genes and each gene can have a different forms (alleles), so it is a sensitive system. There is a "thin line" between a black hair vs. brown hair, i.e. only different concentration of Eumelanin. So the lighter complexion of Crazy Horse and his mother could very well be of natural/biochemical causes. After all this is the origin of the various skin and hair colours among people around the world and obviously happens. It is well known that siblings (individuals with same genes) have often different complexion. The same individual dependent cellular biochemical process could explain Crazy Horse's and his mother lighter complexion.
What happened was that some horses owned by Indians had gone missing, allegedly stolen, suspected to have been taken by the US Army, way back in 1877 at what was the Spotted Tail Agency. Some legislation must have come into force because there was a huge number of compensation claims by Indians for petty thefts, etc. Most were rejected. One of them was for these horses and one of the claimants for one of these horses was called Crazy Horse. The application seems to have been approved but the compensation was never actually paid out. Coffee claimed that part of, or all of, the compensation should have gone to him; presumably he was Crazy Horse’s nearest living relative. In or around 1932 the government dealt officially with Coffee’s claim. I think it was for only fifteen dollars or so but Coffee must have been a persistent man. The official reason that the money had not been paid was that the government could not identify the right individual of the name of Crazy Horse. To this end, in 1934, they took a statement from Coffee, by then an old man and deaf. I don’t know if Coffee ever got any of the money. Coffee was born in 1858. I think I got the information from records copied by the Church of Latter Day Saints but I will check further and let you know.
Post by sgoodshield on Oct 13, 2012 12:59:52 GMT -5
hau I am stanley goodshield. All my elders are gone i am the eldest and last male. I am looking for family. I inherited land in pine ridge mostly. When i went to the pine ridge reality office,they told me that the names on the original allotment documents were my relatives. there is a eagle horse lower brule. Is this the same as eagle horse as your article. I am not trying to steal anybodies fame. Just looking for information to pass on to my son and daughter,grandchildren. my mother never talked about family.
Actually, I have never seen the original Victoria Standing Bear Conroy's letter. I have only seen an English version of it, published in 2 different books by Hardorff [1, 2]. In both books the letter is published in a formal format, i.e. as it would look like if you would have it in front of you, with headings, date etc.. From Hardorff's writing, I understood the matter as Victoria Standing Bear Conroy verbally dictated her words to Waggoner who wrote it soon in English (and never in Lakota). The letter is said to be contained in the Dr. Raymond A. Burnside papers, Iowa State Historical Department and was reproduced by a special permission .
It would be great to see the Lakota version of the letter. That could shed light on and explain several contradicting/unclear matters in the English version. Can you post the Lakota version of the Victoria Standing Bear Conroy's letter ?
Furthermore, it would be very interesting if you would like to start a new thread and write about your gg-grandmother Owns Spotted Horse Woman. About her life and descendants and her closest relatives (for example her Mnikhówozu mother Looking Cloud Woman and her relatives). Owns Spotted Horse Woman seems to have been a strong and independent person. She seems to have always stood strong, even though she suffered both physical and emotional stress during her life. As can be seen for example, that she was one of the few who stayed out in the north during the winter 1876-1877 after LBH until she came in along with her uncle Crazy Horse and others. It would be great to see a thread devoted to Owns Spotted Horse Woman.
References: 1 Richard G. Hardorff "The Oglala Lakota Crazy Horse", J.M. Carroll & Company (1985), pages 29-31. 2 Richard G. Hardorff "The Death of Crazy Horse - A Tragic Episode In Lakota History", Bison Books (2001), pages 265-267.
When i went to the pine ridge reality office,they told me that the names on the original allotment documents were my relatives. there is a eagle horse lower brule. Is this the same as eagle horse as your article.
From the information you have, what are the names of Eagle Horse's relatives ? And how are they related to Eagle Horse ? Do you know the name of Eagle Horse's wife ?
OK. I understand if you don't want to "publish" the letter.
This letter is a gem. If you have not already done it. Then it would be a good precaution to take a copy of it and keep the copy in another house than the original, in case of something would happen which would destroy the original letter.
Do you know how a translation of the letter ended up in the hands of Burnside and ended up in Iowa ? Do you know who translated it ? Are we perhaps talking about 2 letters ? Perhaps of roughly the same content but yours being more extensive ?
In the English version of Victoria Standing Bear Conroy's letter are 2 names for Worm's sister: a) "Tunkanawin" b) "marriage name was One Horse" Are you aware of other name(s) of Worm's sister ? Either in Lakota or English. Does your family tradition include other name(s) for Worm's sister ?
Do you have ANY information about One Horse ? One Horse who Worm's sister was married to. For example, do you know of any other name of One Horse ?
What was the name of Worm's brother according to your family tradition ?
To those who are not familiar with the "Conroy Letter" of Hardorff's "Crazy Horse": the Letter dates from Dec. 18, 1935 and was written to superintendent McGregor at Pine Ridge (written or dictated to Josephine F. Waggoner at Hot Springs, S.D.).
The Letter says basically this:
Makes-the-Song & wife had 3 known children
1. Waglula (Crazy Horse Senior) married to Rattle Blanket Woman --> child: Crazy Horse Junior (famous chief) married to two later wives
2. a second brother (killed early) and
3. Tunkanawin / Mrs. One Horse (Waglula's sister) married to One Horse --> number of children ?
1 daughter, Name? (Conroy's mother) married to? --> at least 2 children
Victoria Conroy and Mrs. Pete Dillon (aka Lena Standing Bear)
And with regard to
Crazy Horse Junior (famous chief) married to Black Shawl married to "Mrs Laravere" (Nelly Laravie)
At the end of the letter Victoria Conroy says: "... my mother, grandmother and his father were the only blood relations he had at the time of his death..." Conroy was about 11 years when Crazy Horse got killed and about 69 when she wrote the letter.
Post by emilylevine on Oct 24, 2012 19:40:58 GMT -5
"Do you know how a translation of the letter ended up in the hands of Burnside and ended up in Iowa ?"
In the late twenties or early thirties Waggoner was contacted by Frank Herriott a professor at Drake University in Iowa seeking information on Inkpaduta for a series of articles he was writing about the so-called Spirit Lake Massacre that were subsequently published in the Annals of Iowa. Waggoner and Herriott corresponded for a number of years and he helped to have her holographic manuscripts typed by a stenography class at the University and did a little editing for her. They became close through their correspondence and he was very respectful of her work.
Dr. Raymond Burnside and Herriott knew each other and I believe it was Herriott who put Burnside in touch with with Waggoner although I don't know if the two ever met. I don't know any specifics about how or why Waggoner sent the letter to Burnside---but he was a collector of Indian "artifacts" and interested in Lakota history.
Waggoner was bilingual and able to write in both languages so she could have translated the letter---although there were many others at the Old Soldiers Home who could have done so as well. Or Conroy could have dictated it in Lakota and Waggoner wrote it in English . . . In the Waggoner papers I have there is a lengthy letter in Lakota from Victoria Conroy to Josephine. I have not translated it. These papers belong to the family, so sharing the letter would need their permission. I'm not even sure if it's anything historical or just a letter from one friend to another.
I have a xerox of the Crazy Horse letter that I got from the State Historical Society in Iowa.